Greetings,
I am an artist who sold his first sculpture 20 years ago as an undergraduate. My wife and I have a business wherein I do large and small sculpture and decorative metals commissions for the public and private sectors, jewelry, and occasionally have classes in our classroom. I have my terminal degree (MFA 94) from a well respected private school in South Bend IN, and my GRE scores back then were 620 verbal/640quant/630 analytic. I was happy with them at the time considering I had very little science/math as an undergrad. I don’t have a question, I just want to toot my horn…just kidding. My bad humor comes out when I am nervous-yes, even posting anonymously to a forum.
Here is the question: similar as my basic question is to all the other newbie posts, I feel different enough to wonder, ‘how do I fit into the culture of medicine?’
Some more background:
I am 40 yrs old, haven’t been in a classroom in 14 years except to teach, and am concerned about the perception that my current career and the education related to it is considered just so much fluff in the face of science. I have a brother who is a DO from KCOM, and I remember clearly, at his post graduation, the comment he made to me about how it is never too late to pursue a medical degree (he had a classmate who was around 40 at the time).
I am meeting with him this weekend to discuss this desire of mine, and glean his appraisal of my prospects. My wife supports me whatever my choice. I face an uphill battle with financing, and I will have to continue my business, at least thru undergraduate work, as there aren’t a whole lot of places looking for 40 yo artists.
I welcome any comments, and thank you in advance.
Well, I’m not sure how good that GRE score is, but you’ll have to give us a little more details on your academic history to get an informed answer. You may or may not have to do damage control on grades depending on what your GPA is. If your GPA was good, doesn’t matter if it was art or not, that’s going to help you since you won’t have to repair your undergrad GPA like a lot of non-trads need to. Graduate GPA is probably looked at too but I think undergrad is the big one they look at.
I don’t see any reason why having an art degree would put you at a disadvantage. I would say take a couple of the pre-med classes such as general chem, general bio, etc. and see how you do.
You are exactly the kind of interesting candidate that makes an AdCom officer’s eyes sparkle. Assuming that you can present a well-qualified application (good grades & scores, good recommendations, good experience, good personal statement), I would think that schools would be VERY interested in talking to you. You express the concern that your previous life will be considered fluff. I actually don’t think that will be the case at all. You showed dedication to an interest and a profession in which it is exceedingly difficult to succeed, and have done well. I say, go for it.
Mary
1st undergrad degree(BS 91)Liberal Arts GPA: ended w/ a 3.004, after recovering from semesters w/ lows of 2.144. I was working a third shift job, and admittedly lacked focus, except for the art. This transcript is peppered w/ ‘W’ ‘D’ and one ‘F’ at the end, right before I transferred. Not an excuse, and I believe I have grown beyond this inconsistency, but my mind was on moving to a new school, in a new city, without money or a job lined up, away from a home in which I had spent my entire life until then, and I think I felt I had other priorities. Also, my job experienced a change the last 6 months I worked there when the new location had mechanical problems, and I found myself working until noon many days, instead of the normal 12:30-5 am.
2nd Undergrad degree (BFA 91) GPA: 3.76 w/ 39 hours over a summer session and fall and spring semesters-when I first moved I received a c+ in a summer ceramics class, which I took simultaneously with another studio class in sculpture (A). I earned the C+ no doubt-didn’t put in the time. otherwise it was all As and Bs.
The graduation dates are not a typo- I transferred my senior year and then transferred credits back to my first school to complete both degrees, and attended my commencements on the same day-really a moment in the sun for me.
Grad GPA: 3.858 w/ 51 credit hours
To my credit, I am also an Eagle Scout, I volunteered in a hospital for 3 months while I was in High Schoolamong other unrecorded things, at the age of 9 I took a full course in Red Cross first aid (all 4 books) when I was Junior Sheriff (don’t laugh, its true). I have volunteered countless hours in my community over the last 13 years on committees with the local arts organization and a business association, two board of directorships, one on the Urban Enterprise Association, overseeing the distribution of funds from a tif district, the other a state funded advocacy group for those with disabilities. They ended prematurely when I moved out of the district in the first case, and was unable to juggle priorities with our business in the latter ( I have considered rejoining the latter, as our priorities have become clearer recently, and I left on good terms). We also organize an annual arts event on our property which presents the work of many artists and musicians without a profit, and without a share of their sales.
Additionally, I am often called upon to assist with career guidance and assistance informally by artists we know and high schoolers we know-for example, a Junior Air Force ROTC cadet leader needed help with 2 resumes structured for two different scholarships and awards. She has been accepted to the Citadel, but I haven’t heard if she has been awarded the scholarships. (On these last points, how would I document these examples as volunteerism. It is something I have always done, as I am one of the few formally educated artists in our area, and many just don’t have experience in marketing and promotion.)
I am planning to ask my brother, the DO, if I might shadow him this spring, and we have another doctor in the extended family I hope to do the same with-one is ER the other is FP. Luckily, we have a newly minted 4-year rural med program at one of the local Univs.
Thank you again for the warm words of encouragement, and the questions-they really help me to focus on the tasks at hand.
Some of this you’ll “document” by including it in your personal statement - and you’ve got the skeleton of a helluva good PS right here.
I hope the folks who’ve done applications more recently can respond with specifics about the various community service things you’ve done. My inclination is that anything done under any sort of “auspices” will be “document-able” in the volunteer section. And if you had any sort of organized relationship with local schools, you should be able to list as a contact person a guidance counselor or principal (in the case of a high school), or a career office person (in the case of a college/university).
Junior Sheriff. I love it. And don’t think for a second that something as long ago as Eagle Scout doesn’t matter. My 56-year-old husband is an Eagle Scout and he keeps it prominently on his resume. When he sees it on a resume, he NOTICES it. When I heard it mentioned by med school applicants in my interviewing days, I immediately knew a lot of good things about them. (work ethic, service, able to complete a task, etc.)
Finally, as for grades: do great in your prerequisites and I think you’ll be fine.
Good luck to you!
Mary
- Mary Renard Said:
I hope the folks who've done applications more recently can respond with specifics about the various community service things you've done. My inclination is that anything done under any sort of "auspices" will be "document-able" in the volunteer section. And if you had any sort of organized relationship with local schools, you should be able to list as a contact person a guidance counselor or principal (in the case of a high school), or a career office person (in the case of a college/university).
Finally, as for grades: do great in your prerequisites and I think you'll be fine.
Good luck to you!
Mary
W/re extracurriculars on the MCAT, there's a fair bit of flexibility. They give you general categories as well as "Other." From the sound of things, no matter how you end up putting the stuff down, you'll definitely have some interesting stories to share
. (I don't know how much they'd want from high school, though.)I'd also agree that, as long as you do well in your prereqs and understand the material, you'll be in a good place academically as well.
Good luck with it!
I want to say thank you to everyone who read and/or who took the time to respond, especially you, Mary.
I read over the responses Saturday evening with my Brother (the DO) and his family, and I have felt pretty ‘up’ since then.
My family was incredibly supportive-my parents were almost giddy, except my Dad has never reacted in a way that really fit the definition of giddy, so I will have to say…enthusiastic. I didn’t realize how much their opinions mattered to me, as I thought I had already made the decision. I guess it was the last mental hurdle before I began the process in earnest.
Today I wrote an introductory email, in the form of a request for more information, to the interim director of the local rural meds program, and I applied online for admission to the school in order to register for classes this summer. I hope to get Chemistry I and II, and maybe Calculus under my belt before fall (if they offer them in the summer), and they will help me get back in the groove, proving myself to myself.
If I do well, I will go back full time. I don’t know if I can get ready for the MCAT by next summer, but I can sure try.
Now I am finding it is already difficult, because of my desire to ‘get on with it’, to finish the projects I am working on presently, but I must complete them to keep the cash flow moving. I have to remind myself that I’ve only opened the door, and I still live here in the comfortable shelter of my old life. I will need it for a few more years at least. I am reminding myself more often now, that this is a marathon, not a sprint, as someone wise has said here repeatedly.
I would be interested in hearing from any non-science converts who have made the leap or are in the process, about what classes they took and in what order. I have read some of the other threads on the topic of those core classes, and am just curious.
Thank you again.
By the way, my name is Patrick, and I want to be a Doctor. (Sounds like a 12-step program…where is Stewart Smalley when you need him?)
- plasmacutter94 Said:
I read over the responses Saturday evening with my Brother (the DO) and his family, and I have felt pretty 'up' since then.
My family was incredibly supportive-my parents were almost giddy, except my Dad has never reacted in a way that really fit the definition of giddy, so I will have to say...enthusiastic. I didn't realize how much their opinions mattered to me, as I thought I had already made the decision. I guess it was the last mental hurdle before I began the process in earnest.
Today I wrote an introductory email, in the form of a request for more information, to the interim director of the local rural meds program, and I applied online for admission to the school in order to register for classes this summer. I hope to get Chemistry I and II, and maybe Calculus under my belt before fall (if they offer them in the summer), and they will help me get back in the groove, proving myself to myself.
If I do well, I will go back full time. I don't know if I can get ready for the MCAT by next summer, but I can sure try.
Now I am finding it is already difficult, because of my desire to 'get on with it', to finish the projects I am working on presently, but I must complete them to keep the cash flow moving. I have to remind myself that I've only opened the door, and I still live here in the comfortable shelter of my old life. I will need it for a few more years at least. I am reminding myself more often now, that this is a marathon, not a sprint, as someone wise has said here repeatedly.
I would be interested in hearing from any non-science converts who have made the leap or are in the process, about what classes they took and in what order. I have read some of the other threads on the topic of those core classes, and am just curious.
Thank you again.
By the way, my name is Patrick, and I want to be a Doctor. (Sounds like a 12-step program...where is Stewart Smalley when you need him?)
If you're just now returning to school, I would be /very/ wary about taking either chemistry or calculus during the summer; they are both very time consuming. At the very least, I would recommend sticking to one subject for the summer...I would not try to juggle both calc and chem as one or the other will likely take up all of your free time.
Patrick,
I am currently a 37 y.o., married man with 2 kids (one is 1 month old) who took the plunge into my prereqs about a year ago. I had been out of school for about 10 years when I went back to get my Master’s in 2001, but did not have to take any science classes. I started out last fall taking Bio and Chem I, then Bio and Chem II in the Spring. In the summer I took Phys I and II (not recommended as each class was 5 weeks long and brutal. I didn’t see my wife and kids much with being in class 4 nights out of the week and studying after class and the weekends). Last semester, with the new baby coming, I took Org I and will only take Org II this semester while studying for the MCAT and my licensing exam as a Licensed Professional Counselor. All this while working 40-50 hours per week.
I would suggest starting out with Biology just to get back into the swing of classes. Biology, although a lot of information, isn’t math intensive like Chem or Physiscs. Unless you are better at math, then Chem shouldn’t be too difficult. Either way, be prepared by setting up a schedule for studying. Let your wife know that you won’t be able to do everything that you used to be able to do. Communication with your wife now will make it easier for her. She will also be going through this transition with you. Better to talk now than argue later.
The main thing, and I know this is the hardest part for those of us that are older, don’t rush things. Taking too many classes too quickly just to get them done is a recipe for not doing well - and you have to do well in these classes.
Good luck with your journey.
Patrick,
Welcome to OPM! That’s great that your family is so supportive of you. It will definitely make the journey a little easier.
I must concur with the above about taking gen chem or calculus over the summer. I would avoid condensed summer sessions at all costs when you first start back, especially trying to take an entire year of a course over the summer. If your summer session is the same as a regular session (i.e. the school is on quarters and offers summer quarter courses that run at the regular pace of the other quarters), then it would be a lot more doable. However, most summer courses are condensed. Of all the pre-reqs, I agree that biology is probably the most doable in a summer session.
I took a limited course load when I started back - College Algebra as a review and Gen Chem with lab. In retrospect, I probably could have taken another course, but I had been out of the math world for well over 10 years and had always perceived myself to “struggle” with math and science. It was good to get my feet wet with a smaller load before I jumped into a couple of quarters ridiculously heavy science/math loads. I did take the entire year of organic chemistry with lab over a summer session. It’s not for the faint of heart - I did almost nothing but organic chemistry from 8am until after midnight during the week, and spent considerable time on it over the weekend.
Good luck!
Thank you all for welcoming me; the responses to my questions have all been thoughtful and very helpful, in addition to being supportive.
Many times in these threads I have read about how much time the schooling takes. As it is now, I already work almost every day of the week every week, anywhere from 12 to 18 hours a day, and my wife and I haven’t taken a vacation since 2000.
I would be interested in hearing about some specific examples of personal experience with how this compares to med school. What is an average day like-am I in for more or less of the same. I am ready for the sacrifices, I just like to be prepared-its a scout thing.