Hi glad to find this site. I am 44, and am seriously considering switching to the medical field (leaving aside the motivation factor and leaving a well paid 6 figure job, and not to mention family)…
What do I need to besides taking the MCAT, to have a shot at it, here is my background:
- I have a B.Tech in Engineering (1990)
- MS in Mech. Engineering (1993)
- MS in Computer Science (1995)
My Bachelor’s GPA is not that great, but am 3.95 in my MS. Also, my bachelors I chose to go engineering route, even though I had extensive biology in my high school…
Assuming MCAT and motivation 
- What else do I need to do? Any pre reqs?
- What am I looking at for applying?
Thanks…
mkr
Welcome.
I’m a fellow engineer, and am moving down this path. You’ll almost certainly need some pre-reqs since you likely didn’t get these courses in your undergrad. Check with the schools that you intend to apply to, but generally, the prereqs are going to look like the following:
8 hours Physics + labs
8 hours General Chemistry + labs
8 hours Organic Chemistry + labs
8 hours Biology + labs
2 semesters of Math
2 semesters of English
If you’re planning on applying after 2015, you’ll probably need the following as well:
2 semesters of Social Sciences (Sociology, Psychology, etc)
1 semester of Biochemistry
1 semester of Genetics
You’ve probably had the english, general chemistry, physics and math as part of your engineering curricula. Depending on what you have (and what may transfer), you’re probably looking at 4-5 semesters worth of prereqs, if you go the DIY route.
You might want to look at formal post-bach programs if any are offered in your area, as they may allow you to complete those prereqs at a faster rate.
Welcome.
I'm a fellow engineer, and am moving down this path. You'll almost certainly need some pre-reqs since you likely didn't get these courses in your undergrad. Check with the schools that you intend to apply to, but generally, the prereqs are going to look like the following:
8 hours Physics + labs
8 hours General Chemistry + labs
8 hours Organic Chemistry + labs
8 hours Biology + labs
2 semesters of Math
2 semesters of English
If you're planning on applying after 2015, you'll probably need the following as well:
2 semesters of Social Sciences (Sociology, Psychology, etc)
1 semester of Biochemistry
1 semester of Genetics
You've probably had the english, general chemistry, physics and math as part of your engineering curricula. Depending on what you have (and what may transfer), you're probably looking at 4-5 semesters worth of prereqs, if you go the DIY route.
You might want to look at formal post-bach programs if any are offered in your area, as they may allow you to complete those prereqs at a faster rate.
Bennard, thank you for the information. I will reach out to schools in my area. thanks again
1 semester of Biochemistry
1 semester of Genetics
No matter when you plan to apply, you should take the above mentioned courses for the following reasons:
1) The material covered in these courses is on the MCAT.
2) Biochemistry is one of the top med school courses flunked by first year medical students, especially by students who didn't take the undergrad course.
1 semester of Biochemistry
1 semester of Genetics
No matter when you plan to apply, you should take the above mentioned courses for the following reasons:
1) The material covered in these courses is on the MCAT.
I agree that the class should be taken, but somehow I disagree with that statement, granted that this might be a matter of subjective perception.
I do not think that these two are necessary for the MCAT (even if perhaps I thought so before taking it)and I would go as far as saying that they may even be a hindrance. While you will review things that are "subject matter" on the MCAT, the amount of knowledge acquired will increase your pool of knowledge beyond what you need. You will also find yourself considering exceptions to rules (like the X bar inactivation for instance in genetics) while the passage assumes that it doesn't exist (my own experience). Similarly in Biochemistry, the details of Glycolysis, the structure of AA, the krebs cycle steps and so on are not helpful at all (at least the two times I took it).
But I must reiterate that it probably is a subjective perception. These classes are good to take anyway before your application, but specifically for the MCAT, I would say it is not the case. I'd spend the extra time preparing the concepts tested.
I guess what I am trying to say is don't think that taking these classes will give an edge on the MCAT. That would be a very false sense of security. They may (and I truly mean may) help with understanding some things, but the time/work investment could be better spent elsewhere (again, if the only purpose here is the MCAT). In this journey, and at least for me, one goal has always been to use my time wisely. I feel I should convey my opinion on the matter.
@ Redo-it-all, my comment is valid ONLY if it’s interpreted in the way it was given, as TWO parts of one whole as to why I feel these 2 courses should be taken. By splitting my comment up, you’ve changed the context of what I was saying, and in this case, context is EVERYTHING.
That said, I’ve taken the MCAT many more times than 2 and while genetics and biochem wasn’t on every BS section, it was on most of them.
So IMHO, it boils down to one thing for me, I don’t believe in taking a minimalist approach to something like the MCAT or anything else related to becoming a Doc. Those 2-3 mins gained from having prior knowledge of a subject on the MCAT could be the difference between scoring an 8 or a 12 on that section of the test.
Hey path
Like I said, I think this is a subjective matter, and I certainly didn’t mean to put things out of context.
Sure, Biochem and Genetics are on some passages, but the level of knowledge required doesn’t warrant taking the classes. I also doubt that 2-3 min will make that big of difference on test day, but I got your point, better understanding, better confidence, faster answers and so on, overall can make a difference.
Taking the classes will give confidence, and until you take them, you can’t know if you need them. While if you don’t take them, you may think that you actually needed them. So psychologically it changes things a bit for sure. But it is possible to score very well without taking them.
Certainly, like you, I would advise against taking a minimalist approach when it comes to the MCAT. But I think that time can be better spent studying topics actually tested, rather than hypothetical possible higher level stuff that may not show up and that may not even help at all, just to provide an extra 2-3 min. If you answer well enough, you can spare a few minutes. But if time is not the issue, then sure, why not.
But this discussion really is not important, or at least not that big of deal since I assume Biochem and Genetics will be on the new MCAT (?) So the time frame also should be considered.
@Redo-it-all, my main point is that taking the classes to help on the MCAT is one thing. Taking them so you have some exposure to topics covered in Med biochem is another.
I spent a summer taking Med Biochem with medical students who had flunked the class during their first year of med school. And I learned that Med Biochem is frequently the course flunked in the first year of med school, making this point a little more “objective” than “subjective”. Of course, undergrad Biochem is NOTHING like Med Biochem, but there’s something to be said about being familiar with the material in med school BEFORE you matriculate. But then, maybe I’m not a good person to comment on this because I’m shooting for AOA from the moment I step through the door, LOL!
So once again, my point about taking these courses extends FAR beyond what’s going to be useful for the MCAT. I believe covering ALL my bases and over preparation, versus under preparation or just getting by.
I have a background similar to yours, (BS in Engineering) and was active in an established career for years before considering changing course.
I started actively pursuing this goal in mid-2009 by returning to school to obtain the general chemistry, orgo, biology, etc, prereqs.
It took me three application cycles to be accepted. And, no, I’m not a criminal.
Be aware that, unlike regular graduate school, medical schools generally select based on fluff. Once you meet their minimum MCAT/GPA cutoff then additional improvements don’t help much (yes, there are exceptions to this rule). Based on my GPA/MCAT, I was listed in the AAMC Table 24 as having over an 80% chance of acceptance (yes, this was stable throughout).
Just to reiterate: grades and MCAT scores will not yield an acceptance. You might be rejected due to poor grades/MCAT performance, but you will not be accepted to due to academic performance. I was literally told by an admissions director that they would have still rejected me even if I had a 98th percentile MCAT score.
Understand how schools select their candidates: for example, most public institutions have a strong preference for in-state residents. And by “strong”, I mean it can be in excess of 95% in-state students. Private institutions don’t care about your state of residence, but then again they get approximately 10x the applications of the public institutions for that same reason. Also, private institutions will cost approximately $100k more over four years than an in-state institution would.
Furthermore, understand what each school’s emphasis is: for example, if a school’s emphasis is on rural primary care then don’t expect an interest expressed in, say, dermatology/radiology/ane sthesiology to help you during an interview. You will get black marks for saying things like that at such schools. Being able to say you want nothing more than to live in a rural part of the state and practice as a pediatrician would work well in such cases, and they might take you even if your GPA is 3.2 with an MCAT of 24, like one person I shadowed with who said these things in her personal statement/interview. Similarly, if your school has an emphasis on non-medical community service, then talking about how you worked in homeless shelters is a plus.
Rehearse giving the “approved” reasons for why you wish to become a physician. Saying things like you wish for the intellectual stimulation of life-long learning and applying this to deliver the best possible care for your patients is too sophisticated and therefore is not on the “Approved List ™”. I found this out the hard way (“You need to reconsider your reasons for going into medicine.”).
Restrain/retrain yourself to say simple things they can understand like, “I just want to help people” (even though if that’s all you want to do you then should just go become a social worker and you can start much sooner).
Be prepared for admissions personnel to literally tell you that you are a bad person if your motivations for going into medicine are for any other reasons than, say, social justice in providing health care for the economically disadvantaged (yes, this is a literal quote to me from one chair of admissions when discussing my rejection, followed by excoriation for my cited rationales and a comment that they probably would never choose to interview me again).
Oh, that reminds me: be sure not to use your expanded vocabulary, because that might intimidate your interviewers (yes, I was also told in a different post-rejection interview that I needed to speak at a lower intellectual level). Other things that don’t work are suggesting that you wish to apply your dedication for perfection toward patient care, or that you wish to be able to look back on your life and be proud of what you did to make a difference in people’s lives.
So, um, to answer your “what else do I need to do?” question: you need nonmedical volunteer work. And physician shadowing. And probably clinical volunteer work, even though all you will be able to do is push gurneys or rearrange magazines in the waiting room.
Are you (and possibly your family) prepared to relocate? I had to do so, based on my acceptance to a public institution in another state. By the way, out of state tuition is roughly comparable to private institution tuition.
Oh, and stay away from that wretched hive of scum and villainy that is the pre-allopathic area of SDN.
You make a good point about content exposure prior to starting med school. Whether that is a worthy time/cost investment for success in med school…I do not know since I have not yet started school. I will soon find out. I have heard stories of people (non-trads) who took some of these courses and benefitted from them and others who did not and did just fine.
As for the MCAT, I’d have to agree with Re-do. It is my personal opinion (based on my own MCAT experience) that taking Biochem and Genetics courses are not necessary for scoring well on the MCAT. For the most part, I felt that passages with Biochem & Genetics themes were testing my ability to map various relationships and not specific biochem/genetics knowledge/content. Again, your experience may have been different.
Good post. Thanks for that.