An article from Premed mag relating the “changing face of med school admissions”
A very thoughtful read; any body care to comment…
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/05/02/the-chang…
Great article, but it didn’t take long for the comment section to turn me off with the “Waah, waah whinning” about URM admissions.
Yea, I got that feeling too…still great article though!
I have mixed feelings about this article. I feel she completely avoids talking about the reasons for needing diversity in medicine. The reason being that a country with a 16% Hispanic population should have 16% of doctors directed at serving this population. Same goes for the 13% of the population that is African American or the 5% that is Asian.
And whether or not you agree with this, I would argue that realistically, an underserved community is most comfortable with and likely best served by someone who knows their culture, speaks their language and looks like them.
The resentment starts because a lot of these URM are not really from those communities that could really benefit from more URM in medicine. They are from the same comfortable background as the other white middle to upper class students in the class. And why wouldn’t they be? They went to the same $40k a year private undergraduate school as the majority of their classmates. So of course you have people who resent what they see as taking advantage of the system.
That being said, I think it’s good that more schools are implementing a holistic view to their admissions process. There’s a desperate need for more physicians in underserved areas and we need students who have demonstrated a commitment towards that goal. Personally, I’d like to see a bit more of a radical change where we create a pathway for nurses that are currently working in rural or underserved areas to become doctors.
- syr_eng2md Said:
I have mixed feelings about this article. I feel she completely avoids talking about the reasons for needing diversity in medicine. The reason being that a country with a 16% Hispanic population should have 16% of doctors directed at serving this population. Same goes for the 13% of the population that is African American or the 5% that is Asian.
And whether or not you agree with this, I would argue that realistically, an underserved community is most comfortable with and likely best served by someone who knows their culture, speaks their language and looks like them.
And whether or not you agree with this, I would argue that realistically, an underserved community is most comfortable with and likely best served by someone who knows their culture, speaks their language and looks like them.
This hits the nail on the head and that's one reason that the AAMC started the holistic review initiative (increasing minority graduates so that they at least match the general population from a percentage standpoint). Studies have also shown that med students learn from sitting in class next to those who are dissimilar from themselves, and it leads to their greater comfort in treating patients who are unlike themselves. Studies have also shown that minorities who graduate from med school are more likely to return to their communities than others, thereby providing needed care in underresourced areas.
In my opinion, Chen does a great job summarizing the issue and providing links to additional information.
Cheers,
Liza
- pathdr2b Said:
Great article, but it didn't take long for the comment section to turn me off with the "Waah, waah whinning" about URM admissions.
What I want to ask/say to the "whining" premeds who think they are being treated unfairly is fairness to the applicant should be completely and utterly disregarded by admissions committees. The mission of a medical school isnt to choose the best and the brightest; it is to produce physicians to serve needs of the population at large. If grossly under-served communities would be better served by physicians of color, ethnicity, would relate better to someone who was raised in similar socioeconomic status, then the med school should admit as many as it believes would benefit its mission.
My view and logic on this are so radically different that it may make everyone's heads spin.
A medical school should not have to defend admissions or rejections on basis of any particular applicant's background. It should only have to defend if it is fulfilling its mission of producing physicians to serve the needs of the population. Some may some that I am completely stepping on individual rights. And I say, there is no right to go to medical school. It is a privileged.
- gonnif Said:
The mission of a medical school isnt to choose the best and the brightest; it is to produce physicians to serve needs of the population at large.
I agree with both you and Liza.
And I believe that by choosing med school classes which meet the needs of the population at large, adcoms ARE choosing "the best and the brightest".
IMHO,"the best and the brightest" isn't measured by GPA/MCAT alone.
Adding more information here, I came across this opinion piece written by a nontraditional 2nd year med student about holistic review. He does a fantastic job of pointing out why this is such an important initiative.
Best,
Liza
- gonnif Said:
The mission of a medical school isnt to choose the best and the brightest; it is to produce physicians to serve needs of the population at large.
I think this view is naively idealistic. It reads more like an ideal for medical school than any real mission a medical school has. If this were their mission then the process wouldn't be what it is. While it reads well and goes great at Open Houses the reality that "population at large" is too vague and is tantamount to a premed responding to the "why medicine?" with "Because I care."
- pathdr2b Said:
- gonnif Said:
The mission of a medical school isnt to choose the best and the brightest; it is to produce physicians to serve needs of the population at large.
I agree with both you and Liza.
And I believe that by choosing med school classes which meet the needs of the population at large, adcoms ARE choosing "the best and the brightest".
IMHO,"the best and the brightest" isn't measured by GPA/MCAT alone.
And I'm agreeing with all three of you. That last statement, ["the best and the brightest" isn't measured by GPA/MCAT alone.] is the reason for my dim view on 40% of x should equal 40% of y templates. Percentages only serve to *comply* with diversity, not value diversity.
An example is that we had a student from an area of the world where hinduism is common. (which complied with diversity goals. check.) The religious studies class topic was on a being that desired to have a mind, and was granted that wish. None of the rest of us American students could comprehend how a being could desire to have a mind and make that wish, without first having a mind. We all thought having a mind was a prerequiste to having a desire. (which is a Western understanding of the subject on the global stage.)
The eastern student was totally stumped we felt that way, and rather exasperatedly declared "of course you can have desire without a mind. Even plants have desire because they grow toward the sun!" No one agreed, but everyone understood. Spiders go toward food, they "desire" it, but don't really have much of a "mind". I'm thankful that student was in the class, I valued her input, and I would never have "got it" without her insight.
So…weird question. How creepy would it look to the ADCOMS if someone who never took the SAT’s or ACT’s, went out of their way as someone in their 30’s and took one of the tests above? Part of me thinks that it would show dedication but the other part says that it looks awful weird, lol.
Has anyone here ever taken the SAT or ACT laaate in life to be more competitive? I would do it if it’s worth it.
I took the SAT when I was 21; while already enrolled at a community college. (I was attempting to follow my girlfriend to an out of state university at the time)
Eh, hopefully it won’t hurt to try.
what would be the point?
If it would help get into this program or that, I could see it. If not, why bother?
That’s the thing I’m wondering aloud. If it helps to get in, then why not take it. If it doesn’t, I suppose I’m no worse off…just took a test I never took that will be useless.