Organic Chemistry

Thanks Denise,
My fiance knows I’m upset, but still told me it was a good reality check since I’m used to getting good grades .
He’s probably right, but I’ll only admit it here .

Hey Meg,
you can’t get so depressed about your first grade! My GenChem professor used to tell us to treat this first exam as a hiccup…;). I don’t know why, but I usually do the worst on my first exams .
Anyway! make sure that you know your nomenclature - you’ll never have enough of it in Organics! It will be coming back on every exam. And again! - 68% doesn’t mean that you’ll end up getting B, not even mentioning C!!! Especially that later in the semester the class average may drop below 50% (then your 68% will look great!)
Good luck!
Kasia

Thanks for sharing everyone!
I just started O-Chem this week!

Good luck!
Larry

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Thanks for sharing everyone!
I just started O-Chem this week!


Jeff, I know I’ve said it before but now that you’re dipping your toe into the interesting waters of O-chem, it’s time to say it again: REMEMBER TO HAVE FUN WITH IT.
You’re learning the actual building blocks of how we are put together - how cool is that? You’re going to learn why some atoms go together to form molecules (and how), and why others just don’t make good combinations. You’re going to actual do some of these reactions in lab.
There was a book series (or maybe a TV show? I forget) quite a few years ago called How Things Work. O-chem is the original How Things Work. It is just very, very cool and if you are able to retain your sense of marvel at the things you’re learning, I think you’ll enjoy the class more.
Same thing with the labs: it would be easy to get exasperated because a lot of times, they’re not going to turn out the way they were supposed to. Attention to detail is VERY important in o-chem lab, and you’ll get to see what happens when the details aren’t quite right… or when you’ve lost sight of one detail that turns out to be critical. It sharpens your observation skills and your powers of deduction, that’s for sure.
And there’s just no way to underestimate the value of 1, preparation and 2, practice. Do problems until you are SURE you can solve them all. Prepare for lab and prepare for class so that when you hear things explained, your response is, “Oh, okay, that’s what that means - I was sort of on the right track.”
And finally, yeah, o-chem is the big weed-out class, that’s true. Instead of looking at that as a big negative, though, think of it as an opportunity: this is your chance to be “weeded IN.” You absolutely can do this, and learning to do well in o-chem is going to help you a lot with the volume and nature of material you’ll face in med school.
So, good luck! AND, have fun!
Mary

Gina
Okay, at the risk of exposing my own stupidity, I hope this will encourage. I (cringe) actually am enjoying orgo I! I study hard, memorize concepts, build models. I have not found a (free) tutor yet, but that is next. My first test grade??? 61%…yep a whopping sixty one percent. Mostly stupid mistakes (at least that is what I keep telling myself). We do not get to drop the lowest grade either. After that result, and a whopping 58% on my Calc I test, I was ready to quit school. Then I realized a few things that seemed to help. Class average for Orgo I was a 55%…makes my 61 look not so bad (not great, but not as bad as before), and I would guess a full 75% of the class has had Orgo I before. The curve was 74-100 = A. Granted my 61% was a high C, but a lot better than the first perceived F. And the final thing that made my day (not), was my Calculus test on which I received a 58%. After reviewing the test with friends who scored much better, I discovered it was not really stupid mistakes, it is in the grading too. I went to the instructor, and two problems that another friend did exactly the same and got right, were counted wrong on my test. Well, the instructor still insisted I was wrong (I could not turn in a friend), and then the instructor told me “maybe I should drop the course because I was older and had a career anyway”. Hmmm, that one stung!! It is only the first test.
The moral of the story is, Gina, take a deep breath, keep plugging along, do the best you can, and a B is not the end of the world.
carol
"This too shall pass!"

You were a lot nicer than I would have been!

Carol,
Thanks for the response. I did finally get through Organic and managed to pull off a B. It’s so frustrating to go into a class that’s so hard that the average grade is an F. But on the upside, I worked a lot harder because I was terrified of getting that F.
It’s funny, I’m now taking Biochem and for the first two weeks of class, I thought, “Oh no, this is just like organic!” But it got better before I had worked myself into a complete panic.
Now, I’m just waiting on interviews! Good luck to everyone who’s taking organic right now. I feel your pain, but you’ll get through it.
Gina

I find that not relying soley upon one text is helpful; i.e. use another text as well, and do problems. I think the Orgo books by T. Graham Solomon is very good. Get a solutions manual as well for both texts. When it comes down to it, what professors are testing you on is not just what you know but how fast you can regurgitate information, and how easily you can apply what you know to unforeseen chemistry problems. I find that the more practice problems I do, the better I get at solving hitherto unforeseen test problems.
Also, Practice, practice, practice. Get old exams and do them under timed conditions; if you can do your test in the same lecture hall/room iin which you will be taking your real test, then the more realistic is your studying. This morning I took a chem midterm; two hours before the midterm, I took a second practice midterm to check for any last minute holes in my studying. However, I do not recommend you wait until the last minute to do this; start at least a few days ahead of time to find your weak points and focus on them.

Well, I got my chem test back yesterday, and to my surprise, I aced it: 100%. The class average was 65%. Now everybody wants to study with me. I think that doing timed practice tests and using them to find out my weak areas was the most helpful thing I did.

Wow, way to go!!!
Organic chemistry is a hard class. It was the most challenging class for me…and to my surprise I also scored 100% once or twice!!! (but I had some weaker tests too!)
Hope you’ll do equally well on the remaing test!
Kasia

OK, here’s a question for all of you…
Has anyone ever gotten a C in O chem and gotten into med school?
Organic is truly the pits. It seems as though the profs and the TAs are unusually sadistic, as well. One little comma out of place, or, God help you if the bond is not under the carbon, 3 points off. I don’t know what the point of all of this is…torturing my family and myself like this when I might not get into med school now. Withdraw day is tomorrow, and the next test is Thursday, for heaven’s sakes. I had a 3.59 until this, and I was taking an archaeology course,(an A so far) as it’s a intensive writing class, to help me get ready for the MCAT. My head is spinning.
Sorry for the rant, but if anyone’s ever gotten a C and gotten in, please let me know.
Jeff K

I am sure there are people who’ve gotten into med school with a C in o-chem, but I would like to challenge your attitude about “one little comma out of place” or where the C-bond goes. Sure it’s academic in o-chem but you are learning a scientific discipline where details matter. In my CURRENT life, it makes a big difference whether I order 0.25 mg of digoxin or 25mg of digoxin. I like to think that at least some of my scientifically painstaking habits came about because I realized in physics and chemistry that the details matter.
Don’t mean to bust your chops but that’s how I see it!
Mary

Jeff,
why are you so sure that you’re going to get C? In classes like this there is usually a huge curve. So it might not be as bad as you think. I bet there are people who got into with C in Orgo (or something else), but I do understand your concern…I don’t know what I’d do if I was about to get C. Just try to jugde what grade you’re really most likely to earn and make the best decision you can.

Well, Mary, I understand where you are coming from, as I too get calls like that all night from the pharmacists where I work. Nonetheless, the prof has even said that “the TAs have a chip on their shoulders” and you’d think that on the first test, they’d cut you some kind of slack. Three points off for forgetting a comma, I think, is kinda harsh. By the way, the median score for the first test was a 52, and the SD was 20. I am working my butt off and getting little results. I have an A in the lab and an A in the Anthro class, but just wanted to see if anyone’s experience was similar to mine and they were succesful.
Thanks for the replies.
JK

Jeff,
I have to agree with Mary about details being important, and along with that, is the social aspect. You are ALWAYS going to work or interact with some people who are total jerks, sadistic even, or who don’t give a flying **** but you will have to focus on what you need to do to succeed. Good luck,
Kathy

If it only it were fair…
I took o-chem in an evening program affiliated with an informal post-bacc program in the DC area. The professors and TA’s genuinely liked the “night students” as we were called because we were generally more diligent and mature (in all senses of the word). The calibur of student in the class was excellent. Everyone was gunning for the A’s. Everyone was equally capable of getting them. And, we all had a great deal of stake in the process.
The professor, however, insisted upon a grading curve. One of my fellow post-baccers had heard about this and so decided to rearrange his work schedule so he could take the “day” professor with the undergrad students. There was still a curve, but he was competing with a lot of other people, with a larger proportion of people less serious and less academically prepared for the rigors of O-Chem. I felt that this was incredibly unfair. There were people in my class with PhD’s in other science-related fields who were making the switch to medicine and knocking out ochem to get there. There were people in my class who had already taken it years ago and were refreshing for the application process. And, no one in this class was accustomed to getting less than an A. With a curve distribution, that coveted A was almost impossible to get.
I just barely missed the cutoff and lost my A first semester to two gentleman who were outstanding students, and I was incredibly proud of given the competition. I came back in second semester fighting harder to get an A, and I succeeded to the chagrin of one of the PhDs.
Now, personally, I think this type of grading system and competitive environment is counterproductive to learning. But, that’s how it was. And, from what I know from my friends in med school now, this is the same experience you will have there.
My point is simply that your TA may be ten times harder than someone else’s. Your professor may be incredibly unfair in his grading. However, you still have to get through it and work as hard as you can to adapt to the situation and make the best of it. If you are committed to this endeavor, you may encounter situations where your resident or attending is notoriously harder than others and makes you work ten times harder for a High Pass in your clerkship than another. You will be competing for grades in some schools against very high calibur people who are not used to getting less than an A.
It’s not fair, but it is the way the system works. I suppose as Mary pointed out, this is part of the education process.
Good luck. I encourage you not to give up. I almost gave up after my B in first semester oChem, then I came back with a vengeance in second semester. My admissions committees won’t know how unfair the whole thing was. They’ll just see the B and put it into context. But, it was a personal accomplishment, and I learned the material very well.
Good luck.

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OK, here’s a question for all of you…
Has anyone ever gotten a C in O chem and gotten into med school?


I got in with C’s in Ochem 5 years ago, BUT I also had a Master’s in Chemistry and one of the requirements for that Master’s was passage (with a “B” or better, NOT curved) of a cumulative exam in General, Analytical, and Organic chem.
So while I did make C’s many, many, many years ago in both organic chemistry classes (after doing worse than that previously), I think my much more recent MCAT and MS degree “helped” a bit in that respect.

Sometimes it’s helpful to remember that ochem is meant to be sick and mess with your mind, so don’t fall into that. I thought I would never get it, but when we got to the serious stereochemistry, I said, “Finally, something for a right-brained person.” I studied all the time, and mechanisms became my walking meditation. What would I be if I weren’t studying ochem? I miss it, so much more fun than biology. I got an A+ on the first class, and an A on the second. I thought for sure I would flunk.