Twisted path to premed (x2) at 37

By way of introduction, here is my winding story along with some questions for those kind enough to bear with my long story and give a reply For those of you who would rather skip to the basic info and questions without the back story, I have a paragraph at the end called “The Basics”.


I attended a competitive, liberal arts college starting nearly 20 years ago. My goal was a premed curriculum, and I declared a Bio major and assumed a psych minor would be good for working with patients. Unfortunately, I exempted Bio 101 and 102 so they put me in my first course at a 300 level bio course! At the same time, I had taken a job working with a school medical team which was supposed to be 15 hours per week but turned out to be 30+ hours. With chem and advanced bio courses and a nearly full-time job along with my regular liberal arts courses, the year did not go swimmingly. I never failed a course, but I had a few Cs and a couple of Ds in sciences and math. After I stupidly and unsuccessfully took Organic in summer school, I decided this premed major was probably a lost cause, particularly after my bio advisor told me that I didn’t have a shot at med school with my grades.


Knowing little about med school admissions besides what my advisor had told me and the few library books I could find, I decided he was right and I should end it (unfortunately, this was pre-internet). I switched bio to my minor and psych became my major. In psych, I graduated with a 3.7 mean GPA and enjoyed the scientific psych courses (experimental, learning and behavior, biopsychology, etc.). My new psych advisor suggested I go to grad school in psychology, even if my cumulative GPA wasn’t as high as it could have been given my poor freshman overall performance. I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do at that point, as I had planned to be a physician, so I decided to work for a bit and see if anything struck my fancy. After working for two years in a psychiatric facility (constant patient contact, tx planning, consults with docs and social workers) I decided that the human warehousing I had seen for many psychiatric patients was of little interest to me. I thought “What could I ever do to TRULY help?”. At this point, I still assumed I had to focus on psychology fields, as I presumably had “screwed up my premed curriculum”. I lived in a semi-rural area and could find no professionals with whom to discuss advanced degrees (in any non-medical fields). So, I decided to apply to grad schools in psychology (but I wasn’t keen on clinical psych) and was quickly admitted and began grad study over ten years ago now.


While studying for the psych MA, I worked in two health research CBOs which I enjoyed, but one closed and the other lost funding for the grant I was working on. Soon thereafter, I received the MA degree, and landed a job in education research from which my family and I desperately needed the reliable income. My new supervisor was a prominent figure in that field and he suggested I begin graduate study immediately in educational research (with lots of stat courses). I agreed and began a doctoral program soon thereafter, which earned me a work promotion the next year. I didn’t find the studies very interesting, but we had adopted an older child (bad timing, but due to her acute need), and I needed to keep my job. Due to familial and departmental circumstances, I didn’t finish the doctorate, but transferred my courses to the EdM degree. Overall, I worked in the field for ten years until our daughter graduated high school and went off to college (success!). The many years I spend coordinating our daughter’s medical and psychiatric issues reignited the medical spark I had suppressed for so long. I correctly diagnosed my daughter’s complex problems before any of her physicians did, and I really liked that part of the process, the history, discovery and diagnosis. So, here I stand years after my first failed attempt at a premed curriculum, ready to give it another go… but not terribly confident yet. The one benefit I have now that I didn’t have as an undergrad is a great deal more maturity.


THE BASICS:


*BS, Psychology, 3.2 UGPA, 3.7 Psych GPA, bio/chem GPA, 2.8


*MA, Psychology, 3.7 GPA (no bio/chem, only stat/psych)


*EdM, Ed. Psychology, 3.8 GPA (no bio/chem, only stat/educ./psych)


*1 year working with college student health group


*2 years experience in-patient psychiatry experience


*1 year interviewing cancer patients for research grant


*1 year interviewing HIV patients for research grant


*The remainder of my work experience is in education research.


*** My questions are as follows:

  1. Does this educational/career trajectory seem a bit too bizarre and ‘unexplainable’ for adcoms?

  2. Will my poor undergrad natural science performance be a major hindrance?

  3. Is there an advantage to enrolling in a formal post-bacc program that provides a certificate versus simply taking prereqs nomatriculated?

  4. Should I continue to work full time and attend post-bacc courses part time? I assume I’ll have to redo all the admissions pre-reqs given my mediocre prior performance, especially since I took those courses over 15 years ago (?).

  5. I presume that the sooner I start the better as I’ll likely not be able to apply before turning 40, and it seems some on the OPM folks believe reaching this age can be a hindrance for adcoms?

  6. I am afraid I’ll look like a perpetual directionless student, but I do have reasonable explanations for the “diversions” I had taken. Will my winding academic road post a serious impediment?

  7. I could possibly re-enroll and finish a PhD but this would likely waste at least one year of premed prep, which seems silly at this point. Why finish a PhD if it is unrelated to medicine and I have no intention of ever using it?


    Thanks to readers who have indulged me in this long summary. Any thoughts, hints, or advice will be greatly appreciated.


    -Josh

  • mojo1313 Said:



*** My questions are as follows:

  1. Does this educational/career trajectory seem a bit too bizarre and ‘unexplainable’ for adcoms?

  2. Will my poor undergrad natural science performance be a major hindrance?

  3. Is there an advantage to enrolling in a formal post-bacc program that provides a certificate versus simply taking prereqs nomatriculated?

  4. Should I continue to work full time and attend post-bacc courses part time? I assume I’ll have to redo all the admissions pre-reqs given my mediocre prior performance, especially since I took those courses over 15 years ago (?).

  5. I presume that the sooner I start the better as I’ll likely not be able to apply before turning 40, and it seems some on the OPM folks believe reaching this age can be a hindrance for adcoms?

  6. I am afraid I’ll look like a perpetual directionless student…

  7. I could possibly …


    -Josh



Gosh, Josh (had to, I'm sorry :P)

I'm 44. My route was pre-med all the way from 5 years old to 3rd year at the uni; drank too much, studied... umm... never; failed bunches of classes; partied some more; got pregnant (something to do with partying perhaps); quit partying immediately; son was born and died 6 months later of SIDS; finished the BA at some age some years later with less-than-stellar GPA; worked for the next 15 years in non-medical field eventually becoming VP internal audit of public company and prior to that was partner track at Big 4.

THAT, my fellow OPM, is circuitous!

The only reason I tell you that is my hope that you don't look at your age or your career trajectory as a hindrance but as a positive.

Last week, I sat with the advisor for physiology at the university. He doesn't believe for one second (nano or otherwise) that my undergrad GPA OR my age will be a hindrance. He was supportive, and said quite astutely that my age, my career, my interests, my entire package including my upgraded GPA will be the determinants.

I'm 44 (just wanted to make sure you didn't forget that :)). This Fri I register to START my pre-req classes... start. At 44, I'm headed back to school to take classes I could have A'd in 1982. At 44, I'm stopping with the what-ifs, could I haves, should I haves, must I's and just doing. One step at a time.

Medicine is a calling, are you going to answer?

Thanks for the quick reply jkp2117! And thanks for reading my (excessively) long story. You’re right that your route does sound quite circuitous as well! I am glad to see that I’m not alone in that issue. I suppose lots of folks here have some fairly circuitous paths to get to this point, which is perhaps the reason for a site such as this one. I was sorry to read about your son; that must have been a hellish experience.


I appreciate the encouragement and your sharing your story. I definitely feel better about my almost-complete decision. I won’t be able to start classes until the Fall, as I have to gain admission to an official degree program for my employer to pay for it. I’m wondering if you’ll continue to work full time and go for the pre-reqs part time? Or perhaps you’ve detailed your upcoming steps on your blog? I will check that out today. Thanks for the link. I look forward to hearing how you’re progressing. I think I should call my local university’s pre-health department to see what they say…

Great blog, BTW. Helpful for someone restarting like me! Thanks again.

Well, several of your questions can be answered by reading the backgrounds of the posters Richard B, Mary Renard, Presse, and samenewme. All entered medical school after the age of 40 coming from a variety of different backgrounds.


In regards to your premed prerequisites, you probably should retake the sciences and continue on beyond the minimums to some advance-level courses. This is not because of how long ago you took the classes, but moreover (from your own admission) that you might have not have met the mimimum grade requirements (usually at least a “C”) and probably don’t remember a thing from those courses. How you go about completing your premed coursework is moreover about how much you can financially handle: A full-time, premed post-baccalaureate is ideal because it helps to demonstrate you academic ability as a full-time science student while building relationships with your professors in a faced-paced environment. But if you can’t afford to take-off from work from one or two years, then taking courses around your work schedule and working toward your goal of medical school is better than taking no courses at all.

In regards to the PhD, unless you are really close to completing your PhD and/or will have a significant career enhancement by completing your PhD, I wouldn’t worry about it. It’s more important to excel in your premedical coursework.


With all this said and before you start anything, I’d highly recommend that you investigate medicine (like shadowing) more thoroughly. Don’t be naive and be overly enchanted with TV medical dramas and heroic tales. Talk to physicians. Oftentimes, you’ll hear them bemoaning their career choice and wishing they had chosen another career.

Thanks ihope2beado2. I’ll check out those members you mentioned.


Don’t worry. I’ll definitely shadow, but I worked in medical facilities for 4 years, just not as a medical worker myself. I would like broader exposure, however, and will definitely shadow as soon as I can find a willing doc. I have yet to see any realistic TV shows about working in medicine, so I wouldn’t ever assume that my life would be anything remotely like “Gray’s Anatomy” (thankfully).

  • mojo1313 Said:
I was sorry to read about your son; that must have been a hellish experience.



Thank you, it was and is, indescribable.

  • mojo1313 Said:
I'm wondering if you'll continue to work full time and go for the pre-reqs part time?



Given my 2nd son is almost 17, and I'm a single mom, I will work as much full time as possible while taking classes, at least for the first semester. Given I'm in management consulting and run my own company, that should be doable (if I can find contracts!!).

My goal is not to race through undergraduate, pre-med courses but to work through my courses like a marathon. Each mile being another semester, or another course with each mile marker an A. There are a couple of semesters that I have planned that will be full-time and I guess I'll cross the working bridge at that time. My first thought is there is no way I'm going to work full-time during those semesters and hopefully, my current financial plan will allow me to do that.

Thanks for reading the blog!

Thanks for the thoughts on working. Sounds like the consulting will work in your favor, as it tends to be a bit more flexible. I suppose the key is having a plan and going for it in a reasonable manner. Are you enrolling in an official post-bacc program?


You’re welcome. I’m going to tag it with del.icio.us as well.

The University of Minnesota does not have an official post-bacc, pre-med type program. A Master’s degree does not make sense for my situation.


However, the courses I have planned to take in prep for MCAT and to fulfill pre-reqs leave me two classes short of a 2nd BA in Physiology.


I put in my admission request to the college today and spoke to an admissions counselor. It appears my thoughts are solid related to the U and hopefully, I will get my acceptance later this week, streamlining my move into the physiology department for spring semester.


This made the most sense for me as my 2nd degree GPA will stand out against the first one in many ways.


It might not make the most sense for many others, including yourself.

Thanks for your thoughts, jkp.