I am sure I am not alone when stressing about grades from a long time ago (Freshman year in college - about 14 years ago). I did TERRIBLE…think 0.79 cumulative GPA terrible (but I sure did have fun!)
I did mature the last few years of school and did very well. My question is this: Do all allopathic schools consider and weigh ALL grades despite the number of years it has been? Does anyone know of any allopathic schools that are more accepting of flubs from over a decade ago?
It is also my understanding that osteopathic schools will take the better of two grades if courses are repeated.
Any information will be greatly appreciated.
I have you beat 0.0 my first quarter (4 cr pass in English and 4 cr O in anatomy - helps to show up for dissection and tests apparently :P)
I’ve been a wee bit longer than you and I’m just putting blinders on, fully aware the old crap will come up at some point and I will have to discuss but for now, I’m focusing on solid grades, studying for the MCAT and getting solid score, finding shadowing ops, and hoping for the best.
My GPA the first time around (B.S., 1993) was a 2.51. I took about 30 hours of political science classes in 2004 with a 3.87 GPA (UTex Arlington, but did not earn a second bachelors degree) and earned 18 hours in masters credit (international affairs masters certificate from Texas A&M) with a 3.5 GPA…BUT STILL…the 2.51…HAUNTS ME.
Good idea on the “blinders”, JKP.
JKP: I thought I read in one of your posts that you are only going to apply to allopathic schools. Would you please give me some insight on this choice? I’m in absorb mode about all-things-med-school, so I’d like to hear your perspective about the two paths and how they line up with your career goals.
Best wishes to all of you! We are in the arena together!
I’m no expert here so take what I say accordingly…
I think that math and science classes over 5 yrs. old or so wouldn’t count anyway and would have to be taken over.
From what I hear, med schools are more concerned with who you are NOW. Have you taken steps to correct that not-so-good gpa? Are you getting as much clinical experience as possible? Are you a well-rounded person both academically and outside of the classroom? Do you volunteer your spare time in a variety of community service projects?
Don’t let the past get you down, you can overcome anything and most likely, still get accepted.
Thanks so much for the replies…
I have changed 180 degrees from when I was younger…those early years were just ridiculous. I had no business being in school as I was extremely immature (what a waste of money!)
I was able to redeem myself like the last year and a half of college fortunately, but its hard to bring up those terrible grades despite the number of A’s you get in the end.
I have been very optimistic on this journey and taking the pre reqs of Chemistry, Physics and Biology and doing very well in these courses. I am also looking into doing some volunteer work in the disadvantaged areas near my city.
I spoke to my college Pre Med advisor yesterday afternoon and although she is very knowledgable she was also very pessimistic in regards to allopathic schools. She went in great detail about how competitive all of them are and how they weigh each class the same (despite how many years ago it was taken). She said that even if I continue excelling in these pre reqs, it will ultimately be averaged with the D’S and the F’s I earned 14-15 years ago and thus lower my GPA considerably. She advised me to concentrate my efforts solely on osteopathic schools because they look at the “bigger picture” and allopathic schools will just look at the bottom line.
I am trying to keep totally focused on excelling with everything I can do in the present and in the future and will not let anything deter me. But it is frustrating as hell to think that my immature actions of when I was 18 and 19 years ago will forever come back to haunt me.
- Ltap93 Said:
Yes, I am only applying to allopathic schools... but my reasons are not well articulated. I think, to be honest, I don't have the spine that DO's must have to put up with the less gracious MD peers... Is it openly seen? I would suspect not.
Is there a difference between them? Not in my op but after spending 16 years in the business world and getting beaten and eaten up because I don't have the "best pedigree" and the snubbing I took, and the amount of effort it took to overcome the stereotypes by people who are truly ignorant, I'm simply looking for the best cookie cutter role in medicine that I can get into, and in my state, that is MD.
One only has to look on our forum to the DOs that are currently practicing, in residency, in school, or admitted to understand that success in either MD or DO is very possible. I just don't have the spine.
Last, I come from a very long line of Mayo... nurses, physicians, LPNs, financial staff, and other administrators. It's kind of entrenched in me to be MD (again, don't have the spine, once again in my life to push the envelope and overcome... I just want the ride to physician as smooth as possible fully knowing the road ahead has many bumps - neurology anyone? ) I don't want to explain anymore why I did one thing over another. After 25 years of doing that with my own family, I'm just wanting to be inside "the box"...
Like I said, I'm spineless.
As an aside, tonight one of my dear friends made the comment (to which I must have physically blanched):
“My God, who do they think they are? They are not even MDs…” when referring to one of her ex bfs who was in DO school at the time.
Hence, my latest post on my blog.
I do not believe there is a difference. None.
But my best hat’s off to those DOs on here, in real life, in school, or in interviewing cycle who have the stamina, spine, and spectacular grace to put up with the ignorant, like my friend, whom I still adore. She just needs a bit of education (and maybe, so do I!).
- Ltap93 Said:
My GPA the first time around (B.S., 1993) was a 2.51. I took about 30 hours of political science classes in 2004 with a 3.87 GPA (UTex Arlington, but did not earn a second bachelors degree) and earned 18 hours in masters credit (international affairs masters certificate from Texas A&M) with a 3.5 GPA...BUT STILL...the 2.51...HAUNTS ME.
Good idea on the "blinders", JKP.
JKP: I thought I read in one of your posts that you are only going to apply to allopathic schools. Would you please give me some insight on this choice? I'm in absorb mode about all-things-med-school, so I'd like to hear your perspective about the two paths and how they line up with your career goals.
Best wishes to all of you! We are in the arena together!
Layne, being from TX you should probably consider the Fresh Start program. This would wipe out your 2.51, but only if you declare it before you get enrolled for your prereqs.
What is the fresh start program?
- RAdamson Said:
Academic Fresh Start
Texas Senate Bill 1321, entitled "Right to An Academic Fresh Start" allows a person who is a resident of Texas to apply for undergraduate admission and not have coursework completed 10 or more years prior to the date of anticipated enrollment included as consideration in the admission decision. This allows undergraduate students to begin a new course of study with a clear academic record.
Note: This is an all or nothing option. You are not able to pick and choose which courses to ignore and which courses to count. If you choose the "Academic Fresh Start" option, you will not receive any credit for any courses you took 10 or more years ago.
This means that
â– Courses taken previously cannot be used to fulfill new prerequisite requirements.
â– Courses taken previously cannot be counted towards your new degree.
â– Courses taken previously will not be counted in your new GPA calculations.
The provision does not affect coursework completed between the 10 year prior date and the new enrollment date.
Medical schools do see an overall average of your grades, but they also see a year-by-year breakdown. If your current grades are stellar, and the rest of your application is VERY STRONG, you may be able to write to allopathic schools where you have applied and ask them to take a closer look at your application and consider your strong current record.
Here is a good question. I took classes 25 years ago from a community college and I thought I withdrew out of them, however looking at my transcript I now have five “F”'s. My question would be I am almost done with my BS. If I did not use any of those credits for my BS would they (Med. School - AMCAS) know about the “F”'s from 25 years ago? Thanks
Yes, AMCAS will know, because you will enter every grade you’ve had since high school. You have a couple of options here, though. One is to contact the school and explain that you had withdrawn from those courses and see if you can get your transcript corrected. It’s worth trying. The second is to use the little space on your AMCAS app where you can explain things and explain that you thought you had withdrawn from these classes for X very good reason. Then move one.
Sure, it affects your GPA, but if your grades since then have been great, you will recover. You just have to give the admissions committees reason to look beyond the simple calculation of yoru overall GPA. It’s not impossible.
- samenewme Said:
But it will be if he's just hoping to manage "C"s for his first two science classes back.
Aim higher - you can do it
Thanks! Good advice for asking college to change it to withdraw. I will aim for “A”'s
I just want to make sure that everyone understands that the Fresh Start is a Texas thing. The Fresh Start does not apply to any schools outside of Texas. Although there may be similar programs out there. The schools are not the ones cleaning up the records, TMDSAS does. This is the AMCAS for TX schools. Once the record is clean based on Fresh Start status, your package is submitted to the individual schools in the state.