Is it really possible to get into one of the top 20 medical schools if you take pre-med at a community college? I know anything’s possible, but how likely would this be? Does anybody happen to know statistics on this? Thank you! I’m really happy this site exists, and excited that I’m not the only one considering medicine at an older age.
Hi Duncey,
Welcome. Is there a specific reason for wanting to attend a top 20 medsch? I don’t know the details, but others on here have mentioned in the past that US News ranks (if you are using those) are based in part on the amount of NIH funding $$ received by the school. This may not necessarily make those schools a good fit for an applicant. Just curious about your goals, so I thought I’d respond and to get this discussion started.
From things I’ve been reading I think they want the chem, bio & physics at least from a four year. I’m currently questioning if I should learn some calculus and take calculus based physics. I was thumbing through an MCAT review book today at the book store, and it looked like there were some calculus based physics questions in there.
EDIT: Sorry for being rude, thank you for the welcome!
Long story short, community college may very well be my only financial option. You always hear med-schools spouting about diversity, but statistically it seems to be more of a pay-to-play institution. There’s no specific reason I’d like to attend a high-ranking institution, I’d just like to think that I’d have the chance to. I’ve never read a story about anybody getting accepted into any medical school with solely/mostly community college classes.
Read OMTDave’s diary. He went all-CC.
Thanks for clarifying. This is a topic that interests me as well because it’s the path I’ve chosen. Click on my name and you will see some of the threads on the CC vs 4-yr debate. Or a thread search for “community college.” As LTap pointed out, there are people here at OPM who have succeeded using the CC approach. Though, these days, it’s probably wise to follow up CC with a semester or two of 4-yr advanced science courses. My plan is CC, MCAT, 4-yr, then apply. If I post a good MCAT and good grades at CC, at least I’ll be able to justify quitting my job and taking on loans for the rest of the journey.
Now as far as statistics on people who’ve gone the CC route and managed to get into a top 20 institute – I have no idea.
- In reply to:
I'm currently questioning if I should learn some calculus and take calculus based physics. I was thumbing through an MCAT review book today at the book store, and it looked like there were some calculus based physics questions in there.
There should be no need to take calculus based physics. I don't know of any med school that requires calc based physics, and there really shouldn't be any calc based physics problems on the MCAT. Some people find calc based physics to be more intuitive than algebra based and/or take it because their major requires it, but you definitely don't need to take it.
That being said, there are a few medical schools out there that list calculus or statistics as pre-requisites. So, you may want to check into schools that you are interested in and see if they have a calculus requirement.
- Emergency! Said:
- In reply to:
I'm currently questioning if I should learn some calculus and take calculus based physics. I was thumbing through an MCAT review book today at the book store, and it looked like there were some calculus based physics questions in there.
There should be no need to take calculus based physics. I don't know of any med school that requires calc based physics, and there really shouldn't be any calc based physics problems on the MCAT. Some people find calc based physics to be more intuitive than algebra based and/or take it because their major requires it, but you definitely don't need to take it.
That being said, there are a few medical schools out there that list calculus or statistics as pre-requisites. So, you may want to check into schools that you are interested in and see if they have a calculus requirement.
two different questions need to be addressed here
1) Is there a need to take Calculus and Calculus-based Physics for the MCAT? There is no requirement or need to use calculus for solving physics on the MCAT. Indeed, at the school where I did take calc-based physics, it was clear that the non-calc based students were likely bettered prepared to MCAT than I was from the calc-based course.
2) Is there a need to take Calculus course and/or Calculus-based Physics as a prerequisite for medical school? Approximately half the medical schools require some calculus, usually single-variable (ie first semester calculus). Additionally some schools make a statement along the lines that if two courses are offered, the more rigorous should be taken, which implies calculus and calc-based physics may be in order
Some schools require both calculus and a few calc-based physics. Some may require a single semester or have some acceptable substitute. This requirement varies across schools so the MSAR (AAMC) and the Osteopathic equivalent (AACOMAS) should be consulted. Else, each medical school website needs be reviewed for specifics.
3) This of course leads to the question, shouldn't I just take calculus and calculus-based physics and therefore I am covered? That leads to my "Rule 3: It Depends". The time and effort to do well in both calc and calc-based physics can be overwhelming for some students. You should not risk bad grades by taking too much. This has to be researched particularly for the top 4 to 6 schools that you most want to attend.
My pediatrician growing up and now my kids’ went to CC for a good portion of his undergrad. I think he might have transferred to a 4-year university for his last 2 years though. And then went to the same school for medical school (Minnesota).
Of course this was a number of years ago - so maybe things were different back then.
Another doc, who is also a pediatrician, earned his med school tuition at a summer job (I think he said when he finished med school it was $250 or $300 per academic quarter?). Again, things have changed… 
@gonnif: I’ve mentioned before that some of us actually do better in the supposedly “more difficult” courses like physics for engineering and physics majors instead of physics for business and premed majors. These “in-depth” courses take the time to explain not just how things work but why. Memorizing an equation of motion is one thing; understanding how that equation is derived from first principles is another altogether. YMMV.
Agreed on this post, completely! However, I would say, if you are having anxiety of Calc, Calc-based physics, etc. don’t run the risk of a drop or bad grade in that course. We all know our own abilities. I knew when I went to re-take Organic Chem, I had to put EVERYTHING I had into it, b/c the first time around was so abysmal. However, with physics, it just makes more sense to me, so I took calc-based physics and did just fine.
My advice would be don’t do more than you need to in terms of course selection. If you don’t need to take calc-based physics and you know both Calculus and Physics are tough for you, then don’t risk it. If these come easy to you and you are interested in it, then I see no reason to not go for it.
As in anything in life, if you’re interested in it and enjoy it, you’ll likely be much better at it.
- spoxjox Said:
@gonnif: I've mentioned before that some of us actually do better in the supposedly "more difficult" courses like physics for engineering and physics majors instead of physics for business and premed majors. These "in-depth" courses take the time to explain not just how things work but why. Memorizing an equation of motion is one thing; understanding how that equation is derived from first principles is another altogether. YMMV.
- spoxjox Said:
@gonnif: I've mentioned before that some of us actually do better in the supposedly "more difficult" courses like physics for engineering and physics majors instead of physics for business and premed majors. These "in-depth" courses take the time to explain not just how things work but why. Memorizing an equation of motion is one thing; understanding how that equation is derived from first principles is another altogether. YMMV.
I concur with that, hence why it is a "it depends." Hopefully, my previous post points out that each student needs to research what he/she needs and what would be the best path to do so.
I took Organic chem at a CC a number of years ago, got a B. The professor would always boast about how he is teaching at or above a four year University level and gave us these insanely difficult essay organic chem exams. After the exams he would give us a sample of organic chem exams from Stanford to review and they looked really easy compared to his exams.
The take home point is: Depending upon the CC/professor, you may get what you need from a CC science course and then some, but in the end, its a science course from a CC.
I emailed the admissions people at UC-Davis and UC Irvine about taking CC classes. The ones at davis told me that while they would accept them, I would not be as competitive as other candidates who took classes at a 4 year. The people at Irvine told me that it didnt matter as long as I did well in the classes. Granted, these aren’t “top 20” schools but I still think it ultimately depends on where you apply. I’d ask whoever you’re interested in applying to and see what they say.
I took calc-based physics because my biochem major required it (and I’m majoring in biochem because I wanted something rigorous and interesting that would also enable me to pursue graduate school in case no med schools want me). I just took my MCAT on Friday. If I knew then what I know now (for the purposes of success on the MCAT), I would have taken basic physics instead and I would have majored in just plain biology. It is good to research what the particular curriculum includes for calc-based physics at your school. At my state university, optics and fluids were not taught, so I had to teach them to myself for the MCAT. Also, in general I feel that my prof focused so much on the nitty gritty math involved that I didn’t get a firm grasp on just the basic concepts, which is really all that the MCAT tests. As far as the biochem major, biochem is really chem (at least at my school) - there is very little bio involved. Bio majors have taken more courses with topics that are covered on the MCAT - eco and evo, etc. That being said, there were also several questions on my exam that were straight biochem - but alas, I just started my first semester of biochem last week! - lol. Bottom line: Know what topics your courses will cover and check with your schools of choice.
- Beefymcstewface Said:
I emailed the admissions people at UC-Davis and UC Irvine about taking CC classes. The ones at davis told me that while they would accept them, I would not be as competitive as other candidates who took classes at a 4 year. The people at Irvine told me that it didnt matter as long as I did well in the classes. Granted, these aren't "top 20" schools but I still think it ultimately depends on where you apply. I'd ask whoever you're interested in applying to and see what they say.
Keep in mind that schools can tell you whatever they want to tell you. To all people researching this question, consider restructuring your question when talking to schools to something like, "What percentage of your last few incoming classes have taken their prereqs at a community college?" The number is likely to be low given the fact that this is not the typical route, but it will be more telling if the answer is 0 or 1 students in each of the years than would be the statement, "We consider all applicants regardless of where they took their prereqs."
Just a little different way of trying to get to the info...
- MD2B2010 Said:
To all people researching this question, consider restructuring your question when talking to schools to something like, "What percentage of your last few incoming classes have taken their prereqs at a community college?" The number is likely to be low given the fact that this is not the typical route, but it will be more telling if the answer is 0 or 1 students in each of the years than would be the statement, "We consider all applicants regardless of where they took their prereqs."
Just a little different way of trying to get to the info...
Just a little different way of trying to get to the info...
I like it; we always suggest to contact a school and discuss but maybe we start a thread for the top 20 questions non-trads should ask a school!
While I agree with MD2B2010, framing the question adequately is not that easy because, although the incoming class will count a low proportion of former CC students, it doesn’t tell you how many applications from CC have applied. So if a class has only 1% of CC folks (say 2 students) and only 4 students from CC applied then that’s a pretty high chance of success (50%).
For teaching BIO at a CC, I know that about 2% of my students want to go the MED school, the vast majority is after Nursing and other medical profession. CC usually have a different focus than med school.
To add to this, many oldpremeds have already a bachelor and many retake the pre-reqs. I am sure that while being older is not always helpful, this former fact is certainly something that the adcoms will take into consideration.
So overall, MD2B2010 is right regarding that framing the question correctly is very critical, but not an easy job.
Gonnif has a great idea, framing questions will require some thoughts and many heads are better than one.
Just my two cents.
Redo - That is a good point! I know most people who are taking courses at CC want to go to Nursing.