Can one apply to an MD school (to begin as a 1st year if accepted), while they are in their 1st year of a DO program? Considering that advanced standing tranfers are rare from DO to MD…
One medical school indicated that they would look at both MCAT, undergrad grades, LOR's, and the first year DO course grades in condering acceptance.
Ultimately, if accepted into the MD program, one would have already put in 1 year of the basic sciences already.
I know this may sound crazy to some, but important issues are at hand:
1. The DO program I will be attending has poor clinical training during the 3rd and 4th year, as posted by many of its present students. The clinical years are crucial in getting a good residency.
2. I cannot give up the DO spot, considering I may not get into the MD program.
Has anyone heard of such a path taken???
Hi there,
It is virtually impossible if not impossible to transfer from a DO program into an MD program with advanced standing. If you are accepted into an MD program, you will be repeating your first year as you will be starting over. Out of the thousands of applicants to allopathic programs, I am sure that one or two may find that repeating the first year of medical school is acceptable because they can't stand the idea of graduating from a DO program but your medical school transcript will show that you repeated first year and will virtually knock you out of the running for a competitive residency slot. I can tell you that where you attend medical school has less to do with getting into a good residency positon than your grades and board scores. If you do well in medical school (read DO or MD) you are going to get into a good, competive residency position.
I am currently in a very competitive and very conservative General Surgery residency program with a fellow resident who is a graduate of a DO program (Iowa). He scored well on his boards, had great grades and is an outstanding resident. Many of the programs here at UVA have DO graduates who are doing very well.
The bottom line is that if you do not want to be a DO, you should release the spot and continue applying to allopathic medical schools. If you want to be a physician, you should keep your DO spot and work hard, get the best grades that you can and get into a good residency program.
Good luck!
Natalie
One trivial sidenote I found most interesting. My former girlfriend’s OB/GYN was a graduate of COMP-nee- ‘Western University’, a really great Southern Calif. D.O. school. Accompanying the Gf to her doctor’s appointment, I asked the Doc about the ‘M.D.’ after her name and the correlating COMP diploma on her ‘I love me!’ wall in her office. I had visited COMP, was seriously impressed, and considering changing careers as a result. The following is what she (Doc) explained to me.
Turns out that she (Doc) did OB/GYN at U.C.SanFrancisco-Fresno, my hometown, and that since UCSF is a degree granting institution, and since the degree they grant for PGY training is ‘M.D.’ based, it was perfectly legal for her to switch her title, and license as well, to read M.D.!
Her decision to change titles was instrumental in getting patients for her fledgling practice/business, as nobody knew what a D.O. was in Laguna Beach. Truly, if you don’t have pts., you’re out of business! She told me of she and her 12 yr/old daughter going door-to-door with flyers,
"Dr. X, D.O.,accepting new patients,OB care, great Doc! call 555-1212!"
She had one seasoned citizen gentleman bring the flyer to her office looking to get an eye exam. She had to explain that she was not an ‘O.D.’, and changed her title shortly thereafter.
| QUOTE (timnug @ Apr 20 2003, 11:35 AM) |
| One trivial sidenote I found most interesting. My former girlfriend's OB/GYN was a graduate of COMP-nee- 'Western University', a really great Southern Calif. D.O. school. Accompanying the Gf to her doctor's appointment, I asked the Doc about the 'M.D.' after her name and the correlating COMP diploma on her 'I love me!' wall in her office. I had visited COMP, was seriously impressed, and considering changing careers as a result. The following is what she (Doc) explained to me. Turns out that she (Doc) did OB/GYN at U.C.SanFrancisco-Fresno, my hometown, and that since UCSF is a degree granting institution, and since the degree they grant for PGY training is 'M.D.' based, it was perfectly legal for her to switch her title, and license as well, to read M.D.! Her decision to change titles was instrumental in getting patients for her fledgling practice/business, as nobody knew what a D.O. was in Laguna Beach. Truly, if you don't have pts., you're out of business! She told me of she and her 12 yr/old daughter going door-to-door with flyers, "Dr. X, D.O.,accepting new patients,OB care, great Doc! call 555-1212!" She had one seasoned citizen gentleman bring the flyer to her office looking to get an eye exam. She had to explain that she was not an 'O.D.', and changed her title shortly thereafter. |
Hi there,
I hate to burst your bubble but her medicine degree is not granted from her PGY training but from her medical school. If she graduated from a school of osteopathic medicine, her medical degree is DO and not MD. In a court of law, if she identified herself as an MD, she would be up for perjury.
I know a couple of DOs in Virginia that will put Dr. so and so, Orthopedic Surgeon and leave the DO off but do not hesitate to sign XY, DO when they sign scripts. You receive a certificate after completing your residency but you do not receive a degree. The only way to get an MD is to graduate from an allopathic medical school.
She does her patients a disservice and her professional training institution a disservice not to recognize her degree.
Natalie
Dr. Natalie, I am absolutely the first to agree with you!
Please for God’s sake don’t lump me (Tim) in with those who tolerate academic/professional dishonesty; yet, I saw it with my own eyes. The residency certificate was clearly marked M.D., and you couldn’t miss it as the certificate they give out here in Fresno (U.C.SanFran) is beautiful and very large…probably 36"x30". Her COMP diploma was directly above it. I’m sure she’s still in Laguna Beach, South Coast Med. Center Physician’s Group.
It is ironic, as she was a big proponent of OMT for treatment of pregnancy stress/pain for her pts.
Secondly,
I know from this board you are training in a Gen.Surg. residency. Are Gen. Surg. residencies available to older new graduates? I ask as I'm aware of the stresses and time involved. I'll be 51 when I graduate, 45 now and leaving for an English section of a Romanian school this fall 2003.(Univ.Medicin&Farmacie, Cluj-Napoca). I'm aware that I'll have to experience medical school to make a good choice, but surgery lurks in my mind. A really great guy, who was my gen.surgeon for an open cholecystectomy I had 2 years ago, kind of became one of my mentors. I was so impressed that Dr. Wilcox could do surgery, and talk to me about general medicine as well. I'm wondering if it's possible to do the same.
Thanks,
Tim Nugent
| QUOTE (timnug @ Apr 23 2003, 06:25 PM) |
| Dr. Natalie, I am absolutely the first to agree with you! Please for God's sake don't lump me (Tim) in with those who tolerate academic/professional dishonesty; yet, I saw it with my own eyes. The residency certificate was clearly marked M.D., and you couldn't miss it as the certificate they give out here in Fresno (U.C.SanFran) is beautiful and very large...probably 36"x30". Her COMP diploma was directly above it. I'm sure she's still in Laguna Beach, South Coast Med. Center Physician's Group. It is ironic, as she was a big proponent of OMT for treatment of pregnancy stress/pain for her pts. Secondly, I know from this board you are training in a Gen.Surg. residency. Are Gen. Surg. residencies available to older new graduates? I ask as I'm aware of the stresses and time involved. I'll be 51 when I graduate, 45 now and leaving for an English section of a Romanian school this fall 2003.(Univ.Medicin&Farmacie, Cluj-Napoca). I'm aware that I'll have to experience medical school to make a good choice, but surgery lurks in my mind. A really great guy, who was my gen.surgeon for an open cholecystectomy I had 2 years ago, kind of became one of my mentors. I was so impressed that Dr. Wilcox could do surgery, and talk to me about general medicine as well. I'm wondering if it's possible to do the same. Thanks, Tim Nugent |
Hi there,
Again, your medical degree does not come from residency. You only get a certificate of completion and no academic degree is awarded. The "MD" is probably a mistake as many of my DO friends get mail addressed to them as MD.
I believe that to be a good surgeon, you have to be a good medical doctor first. My residency director always says that he can take a gorilla and train them to do the technical aspects of surgery but that will not make them a physician. Even as we get more into our surgical training, we can't forget the medicine.
Natalie