I’ve been out of undergrad for about 6 years now. By the time I apply for med school, it may be another year or two. My undergrad GPA isn’t stellar by any means and well, taking post-bac classes to improve it really doesn’t seem like a viable option, considering I’ve spent the past almost 5 years in a PhD program. My question is if I do well on the MCATs, will the admissions committee focus more on my MCATs and other aspects or will the sub-par GPA put a damper on the rest of my application?
I tried doing some search before I came on here to post, but couldn’t quite find what I was looking for I suppose.
Thanks!
I can’t say without hearing more. HOW bad a UGPA? What sort of coursework? How much of it was the prereqs? What sort of prereq grades?
For example if your overall GPA is a 2.8, your major was engineering, and you actually got As in your pre-med prereqs, you might be okay…
The admissions process is exceedingly nuanced. Although some schools have “cut-off” GPA and MCAT scores, at most places if you meet the cut-off, your application is then looked at with a great deal of individual attention. It’s not just a summary sheet of numbers - they really do look at what classes you took, trends and so forth.
If your past academic indiscretions are in sciences, you’ll need to take more coursework to show that you’ve ‘reformed’ if nothing else. When someone has an old bad record to overcome, most folks recognize that new coursework can’t ever make the GPA go up that much - unless you get an entire second degree. But some nice shiny new grades which stand out as distinctly different can help eclipse those old bad ones.
Mary
What Mary said…unfortunately, the only point in time where you will be beyond the reach of old “shitty” grades is AFTER you receive your first acceptance letter. Once you are “IN”, those old grades are no longer an albatross. Believe me, it is LIBERATING to come that realization because my original Ugrad grades were not subtly bad, they were Animal House level grades…
Just call me Blutarski…Doctor Blutarski!
- OldManDave Said:
Just call me Blutarski...Doctor Blutarski!
You'd better listen to him, Flounder - he's pre-med.
My final undergrad GPA to my knowledge was a 3.3 (Triple Major in Biology, Latin, and Classics) or something in that ballpark. My real concern is in two science classes where I ended up getting Cs (Physics II and Orgo II). I was hoping that with God’s intervention and I do well on those sections of the MCAT, the admissions committee will look less favorably on those grades. I’ll be graduating with a PhD in Immunology in a year or so and since I’d really like to do more clinical work upon graduation I’m really contemplating going to medical school afterwards. I’m also thinking that I can move slightly away from bench research and yet not give up on research completely. Anyway, I’m trying to decide if I should give up on this route because of my undergrad GPA and pursuit something else or keep at my current goals/hopes. Thanks.
Like many of us, your ug grades are a challenge to overcome. They certainly don’t look bad enough to sink you, though - just means you have to prove yourself a bit more.
Dan,
You GPA isn’t that bad. Not that great, but not that bad. If you only got two C’s in science classes as a triple major, that’s not too horrible. Assuming you’ve done well in your graduate work, though, and do well on the MCAT, you should be a competitive candidate.
Wow. A PhD in immunology. I find immunology fascinating, but it’s been one of my more difficult subjects in medical school. For some reason, I have difficulty wrapping my brain around it.
Good luck!
- dandoe123 Said:
My final undergrad GPA to my knowledge was a 3.3 (Triple Major in Biology, Latin, and Classics) or something in that ballpark. My real concern is in two science classes where I ended up getting Cs (Physics II and Orgo II). I was hoping that with God's intervention and I do well on those sections of the MCAT, the admissions committee will look less favorably on those grades. I'll be graduating with a PhD in Immunology in a year or so and since I'd really like to do more clinical work upon graduation I'm really contemplating going to medical school afterwards. I'm also thinking that I can move slightly away from bench research and yet not give up on research completely. Anyway, I'm trying to decide if I should give up on this route because of my undergrad GPA and pursuit something else or keep at my current goals/hopes. Thanks.
Not to minimize or trivialize your situation, but a cumGPA of 3.3 is not too far out of the normal competitive range & a damned for site away from a death knell. I had 90+ Ugrad hours & a 1.2 cumGPA, more W', D's & F's than I care to admit or remember & when I dropped out - fall 1987 - I was "earning" a 0.667 for the semester. Ahhhhh Frat life!
So, when I refer to "old shitty Ugrad grades/GPA" I do mean SHITTY!!! But, I successfully overcame them & will finish my residency in anesthesiology in under 3 months - and anesthesia is very very competitive to get into these days. It can be done, but it will not be easy. But, even for those folks who have awesome grades & MCAT scores, getting in is still very tough & successully graduating even tougher.
No one gets an easy path - no one.
Hi!
I am so happy I came across this website! I was hoping that someone could shed some light on my situation. I am currently a Trauma/ICU nurse at the University of Pennsylvania and am pursuing a masters in Adult Acute Care (current GPA 3.8). In addition, I went to nursing from business via a second-degree nursing program at Georgetown University (3.5). The problem is my undergraduate BCPM GPA is a 2.2/over 44 credits. Thirty out of the 44 are biology (my minor). I only took one Chemistry course and got a C in it and no Physics. All courses were taken over 8 years ago, but I’m afraid they will always haunt me. I am planning on entering a Post-bac program either UPENN or Drexel and hoping to bring this up, but am afraid that won’t even help. Does anyone know of anyone in the same boat…?
Hi Dave,
How did you overcome your GPA?
Dave’s story is regrettably buried in the archives, but when he returned to college (having done about two years, I think), he started all over again. And got a B.S. in neuroscience or something godawful like that, with a 3.95 GPA if I remember right.
He didn’t just “overcome” his old GPA, he blew it out of the water! If you’ve got a pretty bad old GPA, your goal when you go back to school is not how to get that old GPA up, but rather how to perform in such a stellar fashion that no one notices or cares about your old GPA. Good new grades and achievements can shine so bright that the old ones are harder to see.
Mary
Mary encapsulated what I did very well. First thing you must do - and it is damned hard to do - is stop lamenting or focusing on the past. What is done is done & nothing you can do will change it. And, depending on how many hours are trapped in your old, shitty transcript, “bringing up your GPA” may be a fallacy.
I had 90+ hrs & ~1.2cumGPA, many Fs, Ds & Ws - and those regrettable retakes where I ‘earned’ a lower grade on the retake. I spent the last couple of terms under ‘academic probation’. My last semester, Fall 87, the Dean - who I had to meet with periodically due to probation - told me I would be expelled for academics if I did not withdraw prior to the end of the term. I was ‘earning’ a 0.667 for ~15 or so hours!! What can I say? What I remember, I enjoyed - THOROUGHLY! But with those sorts of numbers, there is no possibility to raise in, at least 1 lifetime, to a competitive level. So, what do you do?
I went back in Fall 96 & dedicated myself to blowing grades out of the water…and I did. I missed summa cum laude by 0.02 points - my final cumGPA was 3.88, a 4.0 in my major & 3.9+ in my prerequisites. My major was ultratough - Neuroscience & I did it at a school that was highly competitive & emphasized a “classic style” of Ugrad education. (at that time, UTD advertised that on the 100pt selectivity scale, Harvard was a 97, UTD was a 95, the rest of the Ivies were lower, & UTAustin was like a 91) I made a statement at an institution where it was challenging to make such a statement.
In hindsight, I probably overcompensated. But, I had no idea how or even if I would be a competitive applicant. In my mind, that left my only option as to accept no less than 150% effort. You can only ever do your best, but you must orchestrate your life in order to facilitate achieving exactly that - your best & nothing less. If your best is a cumGPA of 3.6, then so be it. You will never know the outcome unless you try & med schools cannot accept you if do not afford them the opportunity.
If you ask my wife, I have a long history of selling myself short. To be honest, I still struggle with the demon known as “failure”. In fact, during my senior year of highschool, we had to write a paper on our personal Orwellian Room 101. If you ever read Orwell’s 1984 - the year I graduated from HS - Room 101 is the place the proletariats were taken for reprogramming - they were exposed to what was their worst fears. Most of my classmates wrote on banal topics - the theme for my essay was failure.
I had never failed at anything academic &, if I were honest with myself, I had to admit that I had never had to work very hard to excel in school. My fear was that I would not know how to cope with the temptations, freedoms & challenges of college. It seems that my concerns were prophetic as I exceled at only 1 thing my first trip to college - partying my ass off!
Do I regret my journey? Mostly no. I know I am much better father, husband, person & physician for having lived the life I chose for myself. Do I regret certain things or that I am not further down this path at age 41? Yes, but mostly for my family’s sake & not my own. You see, I love what I am doing - being a Doctor is phenomenal. The only better in my life than being a Doc is being a father & husband to my family. What more could I ask for as I have it all.
But, due to finances, heavy debt-load & my residency work hours, my family has to make unfair sacrifices and that weighs very heavy on me. My daughters, ages 4yrs & 4mos, have never known any different & Dillon, the 4y/o, is fascinated by what Daddy does. We have lengthy conversations about Daddy taking care of sick people in surgery. My wife bears a massive load, by choice, and remains 200% supportive of me. She definitely desearves a medal! Sure, I did all of those exams, endless hours of studying & the stresses of being an anesthesiologist - and believe me, there are not too many specialities more stressful than anesthesiology! And, I got the cool degree hanging on my office wall & all of the rights, prestige, responsibilities & earning potential of a physician. All she got, in the end, was me…sometimes I wonder how fair a trade that was??? She laughs at friends & acquaintences who marvel, “Wow, must be awesome to be married to a doctor!” To which she retorts, “No, I did not marry a doctor, I married a pre-med & that is an entirely different beast altogether”. That earnesty in perspective only serves to perpetuate the respect I have for her.
All in all, there is much more than getting a high GPA or MCAT, or LORs or any of the other things you must obtain to get into med school. The hardest parts are the more intangible elements such as a support network, folks that love you even you are despairing over some failure that 90+% of people in the world don’t even have a clue what in the hell you are talking about. This is a loooooong, challenging journey that is populated by long hours or hard work, both physically & emotionally draining, that is intermittently spiced with episodes of elation, terror & deep sadness. Don’t look at it as though your goal is to get into med school. At that point, you are only about 25% done.
Thanx Dave and Mary,
That was very helpful. I having been feeling sorry for myself lately. I visited a doc at Rush in Chicago and he told me that I should have plan B and that I was too old.
Nice to hear that you overcame so much. It is truly inspiring.
porosh