This might be a good start for a FAQ.
What are some suggestions that anyone can provide for people that are applying that help to make them more competitive applicants?
We know that there are a few basic areas where things need to be as good as they can be (well, everything needs to be as good as they can be).
Ideally, the GPA would be really good, you’d have some volunteering experience, you’d write a great personal statement, and your MCAT scores would be high…
but if a person has a weakness in one of these areas (GPA, or maybe MCAT or whatever), what could they potentially do in the other areas to improve their chances?
Hopefully this will be something we can build on and hopefully move to the FAQ if we get a large enough base.
Andrea
Good question.
Is taking additional science classes (rocks for jocks, astronomy, etc) worthwhile to buff the science GPA?
How about taking health science (medical terminology, medical ethics, etc) classes geared towards nursing?
I would say that one thing that will make you stand out is a ton of community service not just hours wise but time wise. It does not have to be medical either, this proves to adcoms that your altruistic side is strong and you have been involved and will be involved in giving back in some fashion even after you become a physician.
I think that’s a really good point…
There are all kinds of volunteering opportunities too that don’t really require a huge time investment or even going somewhere to do them…
Programs like Project Linus are a great example of this… if you can sew, you can make blankets and donate them… of course there are others… but this is one of my favorite examples!
Andrea
This is a tough question. I think that as OPM’s, in some ways it is a little tougher for us to do this sort of thing. Earning great grades after we return to school is within our power. Doing well on the MCAT is also within our power. Volunteer work is within our power.
Unfortunately, some of the things that 20-22 year old kids can afford to do are simply out of our grasp. For example, someone from the undergrad school I did my postbacc work at went to a foreign country this summer, bankrolled by family to work with doctors overseas.
It would be nice to be able to take a couple of months off from life to do that, but I suspect my elderly mother would be unamused if I started forwarding my bills to her and my dogs would growl at me when I came back. 
So I’ve had to make do with volunteering at the local hospital for a year and a half and I’ve returned to work with a job that I can use to make ends meet.
In the end, I guess you do what you can and let the chips fall where they may.
OK. I have literally 25+ years of volunteer work - Red Cross (First Aid, CPR, Disaster work, volunteer leadership roles), worked as a paramedic, EMT for years and years (Search and Rescue, reserve sherriff, leading to significant high-level training and leadership roles), 24 years in the Air Force and Air National Guard, worked with youth groups, etc.
So, thats covered (I hope). My actual problem is trying to fit it all onto the applications.
Now, I’ll have time next semester (and possibly in the spring) for a couple of extra classes. So, I was wondering if the ancillary (non-medical) science classes would be worthwhile?
Thanks!
I don’t think courses such as “rocks for jocks” or astronomy do anything for your application unless these are topics that you are genuinely interested in. An Adcom will see through an attempt to buff the BCPM GPA with such classes. Note, too, that nursing classes won’t count as science unless they’re coded under the science department - NURS 540, even if its title is Pathophysiology, is going to be an “all other” class because it’s nursing, not biology.
I would say a HUGE asset to any applicant would be language skills, and one of our speakers at last weekend’s convention emphasized this too. If you don’t have facility in a second language, and you’re looking for coursework to keep you busy or keep you eligible for financial aid or whatever, a language course would be great.
Mary
Thanks. I also speak, read and write a couple of languages more or less fluently (Spanish, German) and a couple less fluently (Hebrew, Italian).
How do adcoms look at non-science engineering classes?
I’ve debated a bit on the “are you fluent in another language” question on the AMCAS. I minored in Spanish and and moderately conversationaly, which is to say, I can usually figure out what someone is trying to say if they speak slowly and repeat and can generally say what I want to in response. However, I can’t just sit there and chatter away in Spanish. Anyone know whether they would consider this fluent or not?
Thanks,
Alison
No this is not fluent and I would be hesitant to put that on AMCAS. I am fluent in Spanish grew up in Spain and in some of my interviews ended up speaking in Spanish. So unless you can carry off a full interview conversation in X or Y language do not put fluent. The adcoms will know that you know some spanish via your minor.
Excellent question, Allison. I have been debating this one myself. I have a BS in Spanish Education, spent a semester in Spain, and taught high school Spanish for ten years. However, when you teach Spanish I, II, and III, you get really good at simple things and have a more difficult time conversing with a native. I read and write it fairly well, but when I speak it, I get hung up on tenses and etc.
Amy
Quote:
I think that’s a really good point…
There are all kinds of volunteering opportunities too that don’t really require a huge time investment or even going somewhere to do them…
Programs like Project Linus are a great example of this… if you can sew, you can make blankets and donate them… of course there are others… but this is one of my favorite examples!
Andrea
When (not “if”) you participate in community service to the underserved, adcomms expect that you are interacting with the people whom you are there to help. So, something like Habitat is fine if you are doing more than swinging a hammer and slapping paint…you are actually talking with the families who will move into the homes. Same with sewing blankets. Or being an administrator of a program designed to help the underserved. It doesn’t take on much significance until you are interacting at a personal level.
Cheers,
Judy
I have a question about the adcom view on volunteering. After a couple of mis-starts, I finally found a good clinical place to shadow/volunteer however I’m not sure it “counts”. For the past month, I’ve been going to a hospital’s clinic to follow the residents around. The residents and med students have been great about teaching me (as if I were already a med student). I go with them to examine patients but there is really nothing hands on about what I am doing. Because I am older (than the residents) I think many of the patients think I’m evaluating the docs… So far it has been a great experience and I’m learning way more than I could have ever hoped. And yes, I am definitely seeing the massive amount of paperwork too. Overall, I can’t wait until it is me doing the exams. It is a low cost/ almost free clinic and I am more sure than ever that becoming a doc is what I am meant to do. The question is… Will this count as volunteering or good clinical experience? I go in once a week and plan to be there for the next year. Anyone else’s feedback is welcome too. I was a Peace Corps volunteer 18 years ago so I have that but… am I on the right track.
Thanks,
Jill
Jill, this is shadowing, not volunteering. But if you’ve done Peace Corps, and presumably have been involved in your community in other ways since then (hard to imagine that you would not maintain that volunteer commitment if you were dedicated enough to do Peace Corps), then your volunteer credentials are good.
This inspires a quick lesson for everyone: volunteering does not have to equal clinical experience! Often people will want to do their volunteering in a clinical setting because it “kills two birds with one stone,” and that’s fine. But AdComs are looking for TWO different things with these experiences. First of all, they want to know: do you care about your community? Most personal statements contain some version of “I want to be a doctor to help people,” and so Adcoms want to know, what’s the last thing you did to help people? The folks who have been active in church, school, scouts, homeless shelter, etc. etc. etc. put their money where their mouth is - they were helping people all along. To everyone I say: do NOT discount the volunteer experiences you have acquired throughout your life. You have shown your desire to be of service to your fellow (wo)man.
As for clinical experience, AdComs want to know that you’ve done some reality testing of your desire to be a doctor - you’ve seen enough and done enough that you can be confident saying, “yes, I really want to do this.” It’s particularly relevant in the changing atmosphere of health care, where doctors ara NOT making the big bucks, doctors’ lifestyles are hardly glamorous, and doctors are no longer looked up to as the pillars of society. You need to have been out there in whatever capacity helps you to see the reality of working very hard for self-satisfaction of a job well done.
If a volunteer gig in a health care setting is able to get you credentials in both these areas, that’s great! but it’s not necessary.
my .02, and then some…
Mary
Add my $0.02 to Mary’s. No use taking up bandwidth to repeat what she has just said so well!
Cheers,
Judy
Thanks for the cents. I feel much better about it now.
Jill
Didn’t mean to imply that all volunteering experience should be “solo”…
I think it’s really important (at least from my limited perspective) to have a wide range of volunteering… many aspects of the person…
Patient/human contact is great, and should definitely be a big focus… but many of the “altruistic acts” are purely an investment of time and talent. I know Habitat for Humanity is a huge one… where there isn’t a whole lot of interaction with the family that you’re building for necessarily… but there is a whole lot of effort and talent and teamwork involved in something like that… which I think is a huge expression of someone’s abilities and devotion.
I don’t think that people should exclude those expressions from their experiences or avoid them because there isn’t enough one-on-one contact… but I do think that they are part of a well-balanced experience…
Good luck!
Andrea