Hello everyone,
I’m 25 years old with an undergraduate and masters degree in economics and accounting, respectively. I’ve always thought I’d like to be a doctor. I started on that path when I initially entered college, but somehow got off track. Since college I have worked as an auditor with one of the Big 4 accounting firms and now as an accountant with a small financial institution. I’ve never stopped thinking of becoming a doctor…I thought I was crazy for wanting to go back and spend all the time and money it would take to reach my dream, but then, I found this site. It is very encouraging to see people, of all different ages and from all different backgrounds, embark on this journey. I am more motivated than ever, and I’m going to finally get started on this process.
I was hoping that some of you, who are far more knowledgeable than I, would answer some questions I have.
1.) I know that it will not show on my transcript whether or not my prereqs are taken online, but do medical schools look on you less favorably if your courses are completed online? (I work full time and I don’t think I would be able to quit working to take these courses)
2.) My plan is to take courses in the following order -
Spring 2011 - Bio 1 Chm 1
Summer - Bio 2 Chm 2
Fall 2011 - Phy 1 Org 1
Spring 2012 - Phy 2 Org 2 (Study MCAT)
Summer 2012(August) - Take MCAT
Apply to medical schools Fall of 2012
Is this plan feasible?
The schools I’m looking at are UNC, ECU, WFU, Duke, and VCOM.
3.) How many hours of volunteer experience should I shoot for?
I would appreciate any and all input anyone has.
Thanks
Hi There and welcome. At 25, you are like a baby here and you have plenty of time. So do your stuff and do it well. There is not need to rush and do it fast.
I can’t answer all of your questions.
- Avoid online courses. You put in the time and money, you may as well do it on-site. Rigor is a big part of an application. Online courses are seen as less rigorous (while in my opinion they actually require more work and discipline),
- Your plan looks reasonable. You may perhaps want to start at a slower pace for the first semester, just to see how you can handle the work, start to reset your study habit and organize your life around your school work.
- Volunteering hours. I don’t think there is a minimum. It is good to show interest, commitment and compassion over the long run. It is better, IMHO, to volunteer a few hours a week over say 1 year than to volunteer the equivalent number of hours in a single month.
- Look into shadowing as well. It is self enriching, eye-opening and it may help with letters of recommendations (big part of a strong application).
Hope this helps.
- In reply to:
1.) I know that it will not show on my transcript whether or not my prereqs are taken online, but do medical schools look on you less favorably if your courses are completed online? (I work full time and I don't think I would be able to quit working to take these courses)
As above, avoid online courses unless they are considered exactly equivalent as the on-campus equivalent at whatever school you are taking them. Don't forget that you need to take the labs as well (which can be difficult to do online). Also, don't forget that you will need letters of academic letters of reference - which may be more difficult to obtain from online courses.
- In reply to:
2.) My plan is to take courses in the following order -
Spring 2011 - Bio 1 Chm 1
Summer - Bio 2 Chm 2
Fall 2011 - Phy 1 Org 1
Spring 2012 - Phy 2 Org 2 (Study MCAT)
Summer 2012(August) - Take MCAT
Apply to medical schools Fall of 2012
Is this plan feasible?
Spring 2011 - Bio 1 Chm 1
Summer - Bio 2 Chm 2
Fall 2011 - Phy 1 Org 1
Spring 2012 - Phy 2 Org 2 (Study MCAT)
Summer 2012(August) - Take MCAT
Apply to medical schools Fall of 2012
Is this plan feasible?
Feasible, maybe, but I don't know that I would recommend it for a couple of reasons. One, unless the summer term is the same as a regular term, taking two courses over the summer could be extremely difficult, especially if you are still planning to work.
Second, taking the MCAT in August is also going to put you at a disadvantage. Medical schools do rolling admissions - they invite people for interviews and accept them as they go along. If you don't take the MCAT until August, your application will not be complete until the end of August at the earliest, meaning you will be up to two months behind a substantial number of applicants. Some schools may have already issued most of their invitations by that point, or will only be offering invitations to interview late in the cycle, which may mean that they have already filled all of their spots and are interviewing for the waitlist.
It would be better for you to take an extra year, not take two courses over the summer, and to get your application submitted early in the next cycle, maximizing your chances.
- In reply to:
3.) How many hours of volunteer experience should I shoot for?
There is no magic number, but many people recommend 3-4 hours a week. That being said, it's more about quality than quantity.
And don't forget about things like shadowing . . .
Thanks for your help guys. Did you all find it difficult to find courses that were offered later in the day? I’ve looked at every university within driving distance and they don’t seem to off courses after 3:30 in the evening. What are your thoughts on community college coureses?
Yes, it can be difficult to find the pre-reqs offered in the evening.
As for community college courses, do a search . . . this topic has been discussed to death and you should find lots of good info on it. In short, if you want to be the most competitive candidate possible, you should take your courses at the most competitive 4 year university that is available to you. However, if the only way you can take the courses is at a CC, well, then, that’s the only way you can take them. IF you go the CC route, you should call the schools you listed above and ask for their view on CC courses, you need to get A’s, you need to take some upper level courses at a 4 year, and you need to be competitive on the MCAT.
My turn to agree with Emergency.
For CC classes, I don’t think they would be damaging in your case (As and good MCAT a must). You already already have a degree so you went through a 4-y. Besides, and that’s when the statements and interview play in, you can always explain that you didn’t have a choice (and I would assume having a job and responsibilities are excellent reasons).
BTW, some schools (at least the one I target) will take into account the fact that you had to have a job. This takes time and places a burden that justifies a lot of ‘a priori’ not so good choices, but that ‘a posteriori’ will prove to be the best.
- Online courses - I’m pulling my information from the MSAR: Some schools won’t accept credits from online courses for the core classes (Biology, Chemistry, Physics, OrgChem, etc.) How do they know? No idea. But that’s what the MSAR says.
- That’s a heavy summer workload - I’d recommend taking whatever courses you’re the best at during the Summer.
- The MSAR recommends between 100-200 hours of volunteer experience (if memory serves). That’s about 2-4 hours per week for a year. But it also suggests quality vs. quantity and recommends more “hands-on” volunteering as opposed to just shadowing.
Have any of you, or do you know of people who have, completed all of their prereqs at a CC or at least all but org 1 and 2 and above at CC, and gotten into good MD programs?
I really appreciate all of your advice. It’s coming down to the deadline to submit applications for the spring semester and I just want to make sure I make the best decision possible for what will fit my schedule and my wallet.
Thanks!
To add to above…
If you do well on the MCAT (say 30 and above) and do well in all pre reqs…do you think it matters where you get your pre req work done?
several people have commented so if I repeat something that has already been mentioned, I apologize for not citing them
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
Hello everyone,
I'm 25 years old with an undergraduate and masters degree in economics and accounting, respectively.
I'm 25 years old with an undergraduate and masters degree in economics and accounting, respectively.
Generally, taking prereqs at a community colleges will affect your chances, but it is a matter of degree. My "Rule 3: It Depends" applies here. Since you have a BA/MA outside discipline, and if you have not previously taken any of the prereqs, it will likely impact your chances less negatively than usual. This assumes that you show consistent grades, take some prereqs or additional upper level science at a 4 year school, and that you do well on MCAT.
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
1.) I know that it will not show on my transcript whether or not my prereqs are taken online, but do medical schools look on you less favorably if your courses are completed online? (I work full time and I don't think I would be able to quit working to take these courses)
There is only the briefest of anecdotal evidence of success taking online courses for prereqs. As you mentioned, more and more schools simply do not make a distinction on transcripts. However, there is still only a small minority of admissions staff, admissions committees, and medical schools who generally accept them without distinction. I would still consider it a big gamble to assume that these will be accepted without reservation
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
2.) My plan is to take courses in the following order -
Spring 2011 - Bio 1 Chm 1
Summer - Bio 2 Chm 2
Fall 2011 - Phy 1 Org 1
Spring 2012 - Phy 2 Org 2 (Study MCAT)
Summer 2012(August) - Take MCAT
Apply to medical schools Fall of 2012
Is this plan feasible?
The question I always ask students, is your goal to get into medical school or to get into medical school quickly? Remember you are trying to show the grades, work, the commitment above and beyond to get accepted, not that you cram everything into a compressed time frame
I think this schedule in unfeasible and a gamble for two very important reasons. First, studying Physics II, Organic II, and the MCAT, while working and having those luxuries of eating, sleeping, etc, AND TO DO WELL, is unfeasible. The two most important scores, which are considered almost equally, are GPA and MCAT. You should consider MCAT prep at least a full term of course work by itself.
The second reason that the above schedule is unlikely to bring you success is the rolling application cycle. Seats are filled on a continuing basis as completed applications are reviewed. Applications are NOT reviewed until they are complete with MCAT score. Besides that your MCAT score will not be at the schools until September, some 3 months after the cycle opens, you will submit it blind. You will only know your score basically when the school sees it. What if you do poorly or blow a section or freak on a verbal passage I think applying without knowing your score is mistake many students make. Students often think, well they can just reapply on the next cycle. However, being a re-applicant will flag your application the next time. It is perceived that there is a lower acceptance rate amongst the 25% or students per cycle who are applying for the second time or more
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
The schools I'm looking at are UNC, ECU, WFU, Duke, and VCOM.
you are looking at a few top notch schools. Per school, you are probably competing with several thousand students for a hundred or so seats. You have 30, 40, 50 or more applications per spot, 5 or 10 interviews per spot. You need to be an outstanding candidate, outshining many many other bright stars. Taking courses a CC or online, in a compressed schedule, with a late application and MCAT may not be able to achieve that.
My purpose here is not to beat you over the head or make you drop your dream. It is to help make you the STRONGEST candidate possible on your FIRST application. You may want to rethink your strategy and time frame to be that shining star when you apply
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
3.) How many hours of volunteer experience should I shoot for?
The three most important things that volunteering can show are strong commitment, understanding of what medicine is to you, and underlying personal motivations. Students who spend say 10 hours a week for a 10 weeks during a school term doesn't suggest as much commitment than the person who has spent 2 hours a week for two years at the food pantry or literacy volunteer. It is not a requirement that should be taken lightly
Rule One: Take a Breath
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
Have any of you, or do you know of people who have, completed all of their prereqs at a CC or at least all but org 1 and 2 and above at CC, and gotten into good MD programs?
I don't know anyone yet, but I hope to do something similar to what you ask in your question. That is - I hope to get into a DO school, if not a(n) (good) MD one, with all but O-Chem pre-reqs taken at CC. Your question is 2 years too early at this point ;-) Anyway, whatever you decide, good luck to you.
And yes, like your location, it's particularly hard here in SoCal to find evening courses due to budget cuts. That's part of the reason I'm going CC. $$ is the other. [edit] And please note that nothing in my response negates anything Gonnif or others have posted. I know the disadvantages of the CC route but I have no other choice at this time. [/edit]
- Dullhead Said:
- WhatsUpDoc Said:
Have any of you, or do you know of people who have, completed all of their prereqs at a CC or at least all but org 1 and 2 and above at CC, and gotten into good MD programs?
I don't know anyone yet, but I hope to do something similar to what you ask in your question. That is - I hope to get into a DO school, if not a(n) (good) MD one, with all but O-Chem pre-reqs taken at CC. Your question is 2 years too early at this point ;-) Anyway, whatever you decide, good luck to you.
And yes, like your location, it's particularly hard here in SoCal to find evening courses due to budget cuts. That's part of the reason I'm going CC. $$ is the other. [edit] And please note that nothing in my response negates anything Gonnif or others have posted. I know the disadvantages of the CC route but I have no other choice at this time. [/edit]
Which why my "Rule 3: It Depends" exists. By definition non-trad implies atypical. Our experiences, our lives, our paths to medical school do not follow the usual route. Remember that you are trying to create a concise, consistent, and compelling narrative that is supported by interweaving of academic achievement and committed involvement to tell YOUR story. Every individual fragment of the story will have varying degrees of possible negative or positive impact. Making the pieces you have work for you and your own narrative is the goal.
BTW, I think that in this particular case, the CC is not the important factor but rather the aggressive schedule in which to get the classes completed AND do well on the MCAT AND apply very late in the cycle. I have seen far too many people fall down over that.