Hey Guys, it’s been awhile since I’ve checked in, but I was hoping to get some useful advice.
I am one of the original members of OPM, and I’ve been wanting to go to med school for sooooo long now. I stuck it out through law school, and have been working in a nice law firm for a couple of years but I’ve been busting my ass to get into med school for the past few years.
So, I now have a 3.2gpa & 32MCAT, but I’m a little older (36), so I haven’t been having as good of luck as I’d hoped this cycle. I’ve gotten into several osteopathic schools and the best carib schools, and I’m really not sure which way to go.
Anyone have any advice? It’d be much appreciated.
Sincerely,
mdjd
mdjd, my advice would be to stay here in the US and go the DO route. As time goes by it is going to be harder and harder as a foreign grad to get residency positions in many of the areas in which you may be interested. And, if you need financing, it is much easier to get it if you stay in the states.
I have to add that, personally, I can’t think of a better route than the DO route. I absolutely love the osteopathic philosophy. If you already have several acceptances, then what are you waiting for?!
You are the only one that can make the final decision. Good luck whatever you decide.
BTW, right now I’ve got to say that I’m leaning more toward the offshore route. No offense to DO, but from my interviews, and even though I’ve towed the party line during interviews (treat the “whole patient, holistic”) I’m having a lot of second doubts. To be honest, the more I learn about osteopathy and the cranial-sacral stuff I’ll have to learn/be tested on, the more I disagree with it and the premise it’s founded on.
I could really care less about the letters behind my name, but to endure 2+ years of OMM/cranial is almost too much for my scientific/logical mind to bear.
Don’t get me wrong, I would loooooove to stay in the U.S., but I’m not sure it’s worth sacrificing my morals.
Hey, thanks a lot, Linda. I really appreciate your advice.
I’m not sure what you mean by financing problem? Ross & St. George both offer federal loans. In fact, I’m very much in debt from law school, but still qualified for Grad Plus, which is a federal loan locked in at a fixed interest rate.
Is that any different from DO schools? My understanding was no.
Also, one last thing I want to add into the mix, is that I absolutely do not want to end up in an osteopathic residency program, as I understand that those can severely limit your employment options and hospital privileges. If I go DO I feel like I’d have to bust my hump and land an absolutely sweet residency like OldManDave, or else end up in an allopathic Family Medicine program.
There’s just no way in the world I’m risking being stuck in a DO residency program.
I don’t think I feel like arguing the advantages of DO over the foreign grad schools, so if that’s your choice, go with it.
As to the osteopathic residency programs, the majority of osteopathic students don’t go that route. . . and there are many options open besides family medicine.
As to the OMM, I get really tired of hearing people who have never experienced it putting it down. Obviously you weren’t at last years conference where I did an hour (or maybe longer) demonstration of some really basic techniques and I think everyone who participated would agree that they felt better after their treatments and could actually begin to see how they work.
Anyway, I’m not in a state of mind that wants to argue the points. That is not what these forums are about.
So, if you want to go to Ross or St. George, go. . . and good luck!
- Linda Wilson Said:
mdjd, my advice would be to stay here in the US and go the DO route. As time goes by it is going to be harder and harder as a foreign grad to get residency positions in many of the areas in which you may be interested. And, if you need financing, it is much easier to get it if you stay in the states.
I have to add that, personally, I can't think of a better route than the DO route. I absolutely love the osteopathic philosophy. If you already have several acceptances, then what are you waiting for?!
You are the only one that can make the final decision. Good luck whatever you decide.
I have to add that, personally, I can't think of a better route than the DO route. I absolutely love the osteopathic philosophy. If you already have several acceptances, then what are you waiting for?!
You are the only one that can make the final decision. Good luck whatever you decide.
Hi Linda, I just closely read your post and realized that you're actually in DO school. I didn't mean any disrespect, and I hope you didn't take it that way. Sometimes I just read the posts real quick and don't get to the end to see why someone might be pushing their own position for personal reasons.
Thanks again for your input!
Best,
mdjd
- Linda Wilson Said:
I don't think I feel like arguing the advantages of DO over the foreign grad schools, so if that's your choice, go with it.
As to the osteopathic residency programs, the majority of osteopathic students don't go that route. . . and there are many options open besides family medicine.
As to the OMM, I get really tired of hearing people who have never experienced it putting it down. Obviously you weren't at last years conference where I did an hour (or maybe longer) demonstration of some really basic techniques and I think everyone who participated would agree that they felt better after their treatments and could actually begin to see how they work.
Anyway, I'm not in a state of mind that wants to argue the points. That is not what these forums are about.
So, if you want to go to Ross or St. George, go. . . and good luck!
As to the osteopathic residency programs, the majority of osteopathic students don't go that route. . . and there are many options open besides family medicine.
As to the OMM, I get really tired of hearing people who have never experienced it putting it down. Obviously you weren't at last years conference where I did an hour (or maybe longer) demonstration of some really basic techniques and I think everyone who participated would agree that they felt better after their treatments and could actually begin to see how they work.
Anyway, I'm not in a state of mind that wants to argue the points. That is not what these forums are about.
So, if you want to go to Ross or St. George, go. . . and good luck!
Yikes! Looks like I've hit a nerve. No insult was intended, I hope you'll understand. I really had no idea you had went DO. I actually remember you from your very early posts. Glad you ended up getting in where you wanted.
Again, please accept my apologies. I hope you continue to enjoy the OMM and other techniques unique to your profession.
Sincerely,
mdjd
Now, to just get this thread back on track, if there are others here who are maybe unbiased and who are familiar with the cons/pros of going DO vs. Ross or St. George’s, please feel free to contribute.
This is a public forum and all opinions are very much welcome.
mdjd
With no disrespect to our carib members I think and have been told that any US school will be better for you over the carib. A friend just left to attend Ross. However she had no chance whatsoever of getting into a US school and had tried for 7 years. In a situation like that I would recommend the carib.
In your situation I wouldn’t recommend it. While you post that the initials don’t matter that’s not what I read in your posts.
Keep in mind that you are going to work harder to get into anything except FP or IM. Carib students end up in these specialties at a higher rate than DO grads. The only disadvantage I see in going the DO route would be having to take the COMLEX as well as the USMLE. You don’t have to take both but if you want an allopathic residency you will.
It’s been recommended to me by carib students, current residents, attendings, and even 1 EM PD that if in your situation to choose the US over the carib. There are more than a few PD’s who will not accept carib students.
As far as the “morals” comment…you’re a lawyer…you don’t know the first thing about morals. 
Seriously you aren’t going to agree with every course in your allopathic schools so what does it matter? Here’s a moral dilemma for you, why do you feel it’s okay to study abroad and then expect to come back to the US with your “island” medicine and get anything more than FP or IM? What about attending a med school that is owned and operated by a IT vo-tech school?
There is a flipside that I could get into about DO’s but you seem to already be against going that route so I’ll stick to being anti-carib in this thread. 
I really hope this doesn’t become a DO vs MD flamewar, SDN style.
That said, I feel the OP’s pain about having to learn cranial, which has a paucity of evidence-based studies to back it. I’m not to the point of applying yet, but am not sure I will apply DO. I’d really like to learn some of OMM (that which has studies to back it) - and I do like the DO philosophy. But it can be a hard decision. Just wanted to throw a little support the OP’s way. I definitely don’t want to insult anybody on here who is a DO - lord knows I have nothing but respect for Linda and Dave, et.al. But I think that a highly skeptical person (such as myself, and apparently the OP) can have a bit of a hard time with certain aspects of OMM.
However, everything I’ve heard says to approach the Carib route with extreme caution. I would love to hear other people weigh in on this - especially those who have graduated from Carib programs. I don’t know if we have any forum members who have Carribean MDs, but I’d like to know if those grads feel that they had a tough time gaining residencies, and whether the program prepared them for the boards.
- croooz Said:
As far as the "morals" comment....you're a lawyer...you don't know the first thing about morals.
Folks, this is exactly the type of response that's unwelcome on this thread. Leave the personal attacks for SDN.
- slb Said:
I really hope this doesn't become a DO vs MD flamewar, SDN style.
That said, I feel the OP's pain about having to learn cranial, which has a paucity of evidence-based studies to back it. I'm not to the point of applying yet, but am not sure I will apply DO. I'd really like to learn *some* of OMM (that which has studies to back it) - and I do like the DO philosophy. But it can be a hard decision. Just wanted to throw a little support the OP's way. I definitely don't want to insult anybody on here who is a DO - lord knows I have nothing but respect for Linda and Dave, et.al. But I think that a highly skeptical person (such as myself, and apparently the OP) can have a bit of a hard time with certain aspects of OMM.
However, everything I've heard says to approach the Carib route with extreme caution. I would love to hear other people weigh in on this - especially those who have graduated from Carib programs. I don't know if we have any forum members who have Carribean MDs, but I'd like to know if those grads feel that they had a tough time gaining residencies, and whether the program prepared them for the boards.
That said, I feel the OP's pain about having to learn cranial, which has a paucity of evidence-based studies to back it. I'm not to the point of applying yet, but am not sure I will apply DO. I'd really like to learn *some* of OMM (that which has studies to back it) - and I do like the DO philosophy. But it can be a hard decision. Just wanted to throw a little support the OP's way. I definitely don't want to insult anybody on here who is a DO - lord knows I have nothing but respect for Linda and Dave, et.al. But I think that a highly skeptical person (such as myself, and apparently the OP) can have a bit of a hard time with certain aspects of OMM.
However, everything I've heard says to approach the Carib route with extreme caution. I would love to hear other people weigh in on this - especially those who have graduated from Carib programs. I don't know if we have any forum members who have Carribean MDs, but I'd like to know if those grads feel that they had a tough time gaining residencies, and whether the program prepared them for the boards.
I'm not necessarily looking for support for the Ross/St. George route. And it shouldn't be insulting to the DO's to intelligently discuss the pros/cons of their profession.
What I'd really like to see is a full breakdown of the percentages of people going into specialties from a DO school (like Touro in Nor Cal) compared to those coming from Ross or St. George. Does it *really* have an impact one way or another as far as allopathic residencies go? Because all I've ever read is anecdotal stuff (like "my friend says don't go here," or "my cousin went to this DO school, but couldn't get the residency she wanted," etc.)
- mdjd Said:
- croooz Said:
As far as the "morals" comment....you're a lawyer...you don't know the first thing about morals.
Folks, this is exactly the type of response that's unwelcome on this thread. Leave the personal attacks for SDN.
Did you miss the smilies behind that sentence? Those would denote that I was poking fun at your profession and not personally ATTACKING you. I then begin the next sentence with the word "Seriously". So if there was a question of whether or not I was joking the fact I redirect the tone of the post back to "seriously" would indicate I was joking.
I see you can't take a joke. That is not a personal attack but an observation. You've already professed to reading too quickly and responding just as quick. Perhaps before responding you take a step back to take the post as a whole and not pull a sentence out of context. We're all adults here and all my post was some ribbing in good fun. I see with you it isn't so if I address you in the future I will do so as plainly as I am able.
Perhaps you've been away from here too long but this place does not disintegrate to SDN status.
As far as needing data. Go to the websites for Ross, St. George, and SABA and see for yourself who's been accepted where. Then compare that to the data from the other schools you are looking at. Not all schools publish where their students matched to but you can collect enough to get a decent sample of what to expect. What's more SABA I know has a section of their alumni with email addys. I contacted over 15 and received responses from over half with their thoughts on carib med schools and what they would recommend knowing what they know now.
When you talked to the alums from the island schools were they some of the opinions that had pointed toward staying US?
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn’t do it again.
Definitely interesting reading and look forward to seeing the breakdowns…
Thanks all around…
- croooz Said:
- mdjd Said:
- croooz Said:
As far as the "morals" comment....you're a lawyer...you don't know the first thing about morals.
Folks, this is exactly the type of response that's unwelcome on this thread. Leave the personal attacks for SDN.
Did you miss the smilies behind that sentence? Those would denote that I was poking fun at your profession and not personally ATTACKING you. I then begin the next sentence with the word "Seriously". So if there was a question of whether or not I was joking the fact I redirect the tone of the post back to "seriously" would indicate I was joking.
I see you can't take a joke. That is not a personal attack but an observation. You've already professed to reading too quickly and responding just as quick. Perhaps before responding you take a step back to take the post as a whole and not pull a sentence out of context. We're all adults here and all my post was some ribbing in good fun. I see with you it isn't so if I address you in the future I will do so as plainly as I am able.
Perhaps you've been away from here too long but this place does not disintegrate to SDN status.
Once again, your post has proved worthless and you've contributed nothing. Please, take it somewhere else.
- jdroger Said:
When you talked to the alums from the island schools were they some of the opinions that had pointed toward staying US?
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn't do it again.
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn't do it again.
Agreed.
crooz, maybe instead of veering off on another one of your pointless tirades you could make yourself useful and report what those 15 told you.
- mdjd Said:
- jdroger Said:
When you talked to the alums from the island schools were they some of the opinions that had pointed toward staying US?
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn't do it again.
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn't do it again.
Agreed.
crooz, maybe instead of veering off on another one of your pointless tirades you could make yourself useful and report what those 15 told you.
Could EVERYONE please get back to the point? People who have information to share about people they've talked to or sites they've visited with statistics, please go for it.
I'm seeing an awful lot of claims of bias, ill will, lack of sense of humor, and other personal attributes on all sides of this discussion, and it's about killed MY sense of humor (which is pretty tough to do, actually, since I'm the sort to laugh at my own jokes).
Now, that being said, I think when you ask for advice in the title of your thread, you're going to get a bunch of it, some of it off the cuff and opinionated.
I think I found almost exactly what I wanted. Except I’m not interested in Oklahoma State DO, but instead want Touro-Mare Island. Also I’m not sure if “2006” means this year’s match or last year’s match? Probably doesn’t matter much.
Now I just need to find the breakdown for Touro. If someone can help that would be great!
2006 Carib MD & DO Residency Placements
CARIBBEAN SCHOOLS
SGU
surgery 10.2%
em 8.4%
anes 4.6%
ob/gyn 6.3%
psych 4.3%
pm&r 2.8%
neurology 2.3%
path 0.5%
rads 1.3%
ophtho 0.5%
derm 0.3%
IM 33.8%
FM 11.4%
peds 11.2%
Total Primary Care 56.4%
SABA
surgery 7.6%
em 5.4%
anes 7.6%
ob/gyn 1.1%
psych 8.7%
pm&r 1.1%
neurology 0
path 1.1%
rads 1.1%
ophtho 0
derm 0
IM 32.6%
FM 29.3%
Peds 3.3%
Total Primary Care 65.2%
Ross
surgery 10.4%
em 3.8%
anes 2.7%
ob/gyn 6.9%
psych 4.6%
pm&r 3.5%
neuro 0.4%
path 0.8%
rads 1.2%
ophtho 0
derm 0
IM 31.5%
FM 21.5%
peds 10.4%
Total Primary Care 63.4%
==============
OSTEOPATHIC SCHOOLS
Oklahoma State Osteopathic
surgery 2.2%
em 5.4%
anes 6.5%
ob/gyn 2.2%
psych 4.3%
pm&r 2.2%
neurology 0
path 1.1%
rads 0
ophtho 0
derm 0
Osteopathic Programs 54.3%
Internal Medicine 6.5%
Family Medicine 7.6%
Peds 6.5%
Total Primary Care & Osteopathic 74.9%
http://badbadmedicine.blogspot.com/
- mdjd Said:
- jdroger Said:
When you talked to the alums from the island schools were they some of the opinions that had pointed toward staying US?
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn't do it again.
That would be pretty strong evidence against going island if the alums are saying they wouldn't do it again.
Agreed.
crooz, maybe instead of veering off on another one of your pointless tirades you could make yourself useful and report what those 15 told you.
Maybe if you weren't too busy trying to (apparently) piss off as many people if they don't give you a clearly visible answer to your question, you would get more responses.
I have to admit that if I was at a point in the medical process where I could give you an answer, I wouldn't anyways, because you've displayed an extremely obvious lack of respect and therefore don't really deserve an answer in the first place.
As far as humor goes, it was obvious that Crooz was just making a joke so your response was quite pathetic.
In the future, you may want to try to be a little more respectful, it could help in acquiring the information you want.